So how are ya'll liking Obamacare these days?

[Raavak]

Obamacare is great! I didn't lose my plan, I still have my doctor! I just pay twice as much and get almost nothing in return anymore when I used to have the Cadillac of Cadillac plans. Yay me. Obama is the messiah. Can we crucify him yet?

[Nuggie]

Originally Posted by Bodeanicus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Are you too fucking stupid to use a computer or a telephone to use the exchanges to find a better or comparable plan? Or do you just want to join in with the old White Republicans playing "Smear the ******?" I think I know which one you want.

If you think this has anything to do with race you are insulting yourself. This has to do with multiple groups seeing different paths the country should be headed. Unfortunately the further each group gets down their own path the harder it is to find common ground to base compromises upon.

[Orruar]

Originally Posted by Bodeanicus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Are you too fucking stupid to use a computer or a telephone to use the exchanges to find a better or comparable plan? Or do you just want to join in with the old White Republicans playing "Smear the ******?" I think I know which one you want.

Or maybe he did and it still sucked? I checked the exchanges for the hell of it. Would have been 2x the cost for an inferior plan. So even if my current plan were to double in price, I'd stick with it. However, I'm one of the lucky ones, and my plan is only going up by about 25%.

[myriverse]

There is a reason why the world is increasingly becoming divided into The Socialize Medicine countries and the dirt poor countries. Privatized medicine is an utter failure of a system.

[Orruar]

Originally Posted by myriverse [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

There is a reason why the world is increasingly becoming divided into The Socialize Medicine countries and the dirt poor countries. Privatized medicine is an utter failure of a system.

So you think what we had up until Obamacare was a free market in health care? How cute.

[Lojik]

Originally Posted by Orruar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So you think what we had up until Obamacare was a free market in health care? How cute.

[Barkingturtle]

The American healthcare system actually is ideal if you're an insurance executive or a pharmaceutical company.

And yes, I'd rather have government by the People and for the People in charge. It beats having our health dictated by the Greedy and for the Dollar.

The ACA's failing is that it is too great a compromise. It is a far fucking cry from socialized medicine, which implicates a single-payer system. That is what we should be moving toward if we are serious about reducing costs -- a system where the government is empowered to negotiate on behalf of the people, rather than a system where insurance companies collude with providers to fleece us.

[Splorf22]

Originally Posted by Barkingturtle [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

And yes, I'd rather have government by the People and for the People in charge.

This will never happen. Government bureaucrats are always out for themselves. For, example . . . the Obamacare website (the one that doesn't work at all) was done by one of Michelle's friends from Princeton. It was a no-bid contract. Her friend lives in Canada. Is this what you want more of?

Originally Posted by myriverse

There is a reason why the world is increasingly becoming divided into The Socialize Medicine countries and the dirt poor countries. Privatized medicine is an utter failure of a system.

The American healthcare system may not be a socialized one, but it's certainly not a free market one either. Aside from Medicare and Medicaid, because health plans are not taxed as income, everyone relies on them rather than directly purchasing services from their doctor (true insurance would only cover very large costs like heart surgery or whatnot). The health plans are highly regulated and have successfully lobbied Washington for all sorts of perks. In other words, we have crony capitalism.

Also, in my opinion healthcare outcomes = lifestyle + medical care. And Americans have simply the most unhealthy lifestyle in the world. You can't eat twinkies your entire life and expect the doctors to save you.

Anyway I do not like the American healthcare system at all. I think it's run by drug companies who are only interested in a steady stream of income, not actually curing people. Maybe you heard about the Tampa Bay kicker who had MRSA? Well the drug companies have basically stopped developing antibiotics, because it doesn't pay to actually fix people. It turns out all those mammograms and early breast cancer surgery we push on women actually hurt. The FDA is a pile of shit.

But what makes me want to fucking stab a pencil in my eye is the government going in to a field, whether its banking or medicine or whatever, fucking it up, and then using its new problems to justify more government intervention.

[Tanthallas]

Originally Posted by Splorf22 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

But what makes me want to fucking stab a pencil in my eye is the government going in to a field, whether its banking or medicine or whatever, fucking it up, and then using its new problems to justify more government intervention.

I think we all agree that the people who have the least freedom at the moment are the bankers. Right guys?

[Splorf22]

Originally Posted by Tanthallas [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think we all agree that the people who have the least freedom at the moment are the bankers. Right guys?

Did you not read my post? I said the government comes in to fuck things up, but thats from my perspective as a consumer. The industries in question love the government coming in and setting things up so they can't lose (banking, now healthcare, etc).