Raiding Guild Behavior

[Nixtar]

Originally Posted by bktroost [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The raid scene is a great place when both A/As are on suspension. Things are rotated, some are FFA, people are respected and petitions are a myth.

Almost like they were, and always have been, the problem to begin with, isn't it?

[Krashin]

Originally Posted by bktroost [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The raid scene is a great place when both A/As are on suspension. Things are rotated, some are FFA, people are respected and petitions are a myth.

[Bruize]

Originally Posted by bktroost [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The raid scene is a great place when both A/As are on suspension. Things are rotated, some are FFA, people are respected and petitions are a myth.

Works for a week at a time, but how long do you really think your raiding utopia can last? Werent there issues last time as well? Here is a fraps of FoH talking about holding an issue over Rustle's head to leverage more mobs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wh85...ature=youtu.be

[Lhancelot]

Originally Posted by Bruize [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Works for a week at a time, but how long do you really think your raiding utopia can last? Werent there issues last time as well? Here is a fraps of FoH talking about holding an issue over Rustle's head to leverage more mobs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wh85...ature=youtu.be

Well. you know you got a pixel problem when you start discussing how to blackmail other guilds for pixels.

[paroxysmal]

Originally Posted by Bruize [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Works for a week at a time, but how long do you really think your raiding utopia can last? Werent there issues last time as well? Here is a fraps of FoH talking about holding an issue over Rustle's head to leverage more mobs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wh85...ature=youtu.be

Some information for those of you not really sure exactly what has been going on with the rotations that have been worked out when guilds are on suspension.

The first arranged rotation went very well with all parties working to ensure that all guilds were included and got an equal participation based on their typical raid numbers. Kittens/Infernus/Divinity accidentally left out but a few targets were set aside by each of the original parties involved in the rotation to give up to latecomers. (aw/am both on suspension)

The second arranged rotation went well with aftermath taking slightly more than the other guilds and also wanting certain mobs to be left to race for and working on their PR. AM - F/V relations challenged with the contestation and successful kill of trakanon #3 which popped after AW came off suspension, but had been listed as a F/V mob on the rotation sheet, by AM. Training occurred and was caught on video with AM at fault and two trak teeth were negotiated as concession for wrongdoing on AM part with attempted cordial finality to the event and further cooperation in the future and mentioned potential inclusion in trak rotation if it were to occurr again. (aw on suspension)

The third (attempted) arranged rotation went fairly poorly with aftermath stating that they did not want to rotate at all to start with. Getsome negotiated for some mobs to be set aside for rotation purposes. This resulted in AM getting 25 mobs by default and the leftovers were divied out to the other parties participating. CSG attempted to negotiate better terms (more mobs to be set aside for racing vs defaulting in AM's pile) and were turned down and CSG was technically blamed for the lack of a rotation during this period. AM was also demanding a 12 hour time limit on other guilds mobs vs. 24 hours from previous rotations before they became FFA. I think it is also important to note that I gave Detoxx a hard time for their lack of cooperation and fairness in rotating this round of suspensions which also contributed to the rotation not being set into place; additionally Detoxx had brought up formerly closed and cordially resolved trak/training issue from second suspension rotation period in negotiations with Getsome. Due to CSG negotiation and my interference Getsome stepped out of the negotiation role during this rotation attempt. It is also important to note that Rustle did do some joint raids with AM during this rotation period, however, all other mobs were all raced for and none were rotated. (aw on suspension)

The fourth (current) suspension period started with Getsome being statedly unavailable to start negotiations, however, became available shortly after KT was fte'd by AG and killed by CSG after the suspension period had began but before a rotation was in place. Additionally, Rustle killed gorenaire. Ideally we would have been able to get the rotation started prior to any guilds beginning to fte and kill targets. Between rustle/csg they wanted statue tormax dain doz ltk vulak be left alone. Old world/kunark mobs set to FFA. Nearly 16 hours later still no rotation in place nor a cease fire. Finally a rotation is starting to be worked on for NToV only (at midnight CST). these are the mobs not being touched by rustle/csg: Telk. Eashen iki aary dagarn cekenar zlexak sevalak lady n Jorlleag fesh. Lady m as long as non-CSG/Rustle guilds leave statue tormax dain doz ltk vulak alone. Rustle left Xygoz up in VP for f/v but did not mandate that other guilds not engage it and also stated it must be killed by 7pm EST. Rustle/CSG using firm negotiating tactics to strong arm stating that if they don't get what they want we will just do FTE racing for everything. (Fairly similar to what AM did on the third suspension period).

Timeline:
3/19 10am CST Sirken posts suspensions
3/19 10am-5pm attempts made to start negotiation
3/19 5pm-12am CST attempts made to work out a rotation (several dragons/mobs downed during this 10a-12a period, F/V downed Aary and Cekenar and attempted Jor but it got late and packed up for the night)
3/20 Rustle/Anon & CSG begin killing everything in ToV regardless of the agreement to leave said mobs alone - 4pm window coming for window overlap into AW/AM being off suspension.


Now that all thats out of the way, F/V raid started around 5pm CST and killed Xygoz, Trak and Talendor before heading to ToV where telk had been left up. So the particular video that a few of you saw occurred after Rustle/Anon and CSG had been in ToV most of the day killing everything that was up (quite a few dragons, i think rustle/anon bagged about 8 before this point). As soon as F/V zoned into ToV all the Rustle at west exit zoned out/left leaving Anon at west exit. Telk was engaged by anon and stalled at west exit for approximately 2-3 minutes. (AW/AM on suspension)

People on F/V side were frustrated and what you heard was based on that, also don't confuse some members talking shit with officers making decisions for the alliance. Guilds on this server have a me me me mentality. If it is up we must kill it whether we need the loot or not. Whether there has been a fair rotation or not. Apparently 8 dragons, most jointly killed with Rustle, wasn't enough and they really needed this telk to complete their day.

I think that I can safely say that even if AW/AM weren't here the existing guilds would merge into those roles in short order people would flock to join the ranks of the guilds getting the ftes/kills and soon they would have enough people to contest everything at any hour just like the situation we are already in. Overall, a sad state of affairs.

Additionally, those of you nerds that have the time to monitor and follow youtube accounts and look for these videos need to get a life, step outdoors, enjoy your family and do some self-reflection on what your role in the world is and what kind of person you really want to be.

[Kushie]

Originally Posted by paroxysmal [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Some information for those of you not really sure exactly what has been going on with the rotations that have been worked out when guilds are on suspension.

The first arranged rotation went very well with all parties working to ensure that all guilds were included and got an equal participation based on their typical raid numbers. Kittens/Infernus/Divinity accidentally left out but a few targets were set aside by each of the original parties involved in the rotation to give up to latecomers. (aw/am both on suspension)

The second arranged rotation went well with aftermath taking slightly more than the other guilds and also wanting certain mobs to be left to race for and working on their PR. AM - F/V relations challenged with the contestation and successful kill of trakanon #3 which popped after AW came off suspension, but had been listed as a F/V mob on the rotation sheet, by AM. Training occurred and was caught on video with AM at fault and two trak teeth were negotiated as concession for wrongdoing on AM part with attempted cordial finality to the event and further cooperation in the future and mentioned potential inclusion in trak rotation if it were to occurr again. (aw on suspension)

The third (attempted) arranged rotation went fairly poorly with aftermath stating that they did not want to rotate at all to start with. Getsome negotiated for some mobs to be set aside for rotation purposes. This resulted in AM getting 25 mobs by default and the leftovers were divied out to the other parties participating. CSG attempted to negotiate better terms (more mobs to be set aside for racing vs defaulting in AM's pile) and were turned down and CSG was technically blamed for the lack of a rotation during this period. AM was also demanding a 12 hour time limit on other guilds mobs vs. 24 hours from previous rotations before they became FFA. I think it is also important to note that I gave Detoxx a hard time for their lack of cooperation and fairness in rotating this round of suspensions which also contributed to the rotation not being set into place; additionally Detoxx had brought up formerly closed and cordially resolved trak/training issue from second suspension rotation period in negotiations with Getsome. Due to CSG negotiation and my interference Getsome stepped out of the negotiation role during this rotation attempt. It is also important to note that Rustle did do some joint raids with AM during this rotation period, however, all other mobs were all raced for and none were rotated. (aw on suspension)

The fourth (current) suspension period started with Getsome being statedly unavailable to start negotiations, however, became available shortly after KT was fte'd by AG and killed by CSG after the suspension period had began but before a rotation was in place. Additionally, Rustle killed gorenaire. Ideally we would have been able to get the rotation started prior to any guilds beginning to fte and kill targets. Between rustle/csg they wanted statue tormax dain doz ltk vulak be left alone. Old world/kunark mobs set to FFA. Nearly 16 hours later still no rotation in place nor a cease fire. Finally a rotation is starting to be worked on for NToV only (at midnight CST). these are the mobs not being touched by rustle/csg: Telk. Eashen iki aary dagarn cekenar zlexak sevalak lady n Jorlleag fesh. Lady m as long as non-CSG/Rustle guilds leave statue tormax dain doz ltk vulak alone. Rustle left Xygoz up in VP for f/v but did not mandate that other guilds not engage it and also stated it must be killed by 7pm EST. Rustle/CSG using firm negotiating tactics to strong arm stating that if they don't get what they want we will just do FTE racing for everything. (Fairly similar to what AM did on the third suspension period).

Timeline:
3/19 10am CST Sirken posts suspensions
3/19 10am-5pm attempts made to start negotiation
3/19 5pm-12am CST attempts made to work out a rotation (several dragons/mobs downed during this 10a-12a period, F/V downed Aary and Cekenar and attempted Jor but it got late and packed up for the night)
3/20 Rustle/Anon & CSG begin killing everything in ToV regardless of the agreement to leave said mobs alone - 4pm window coming for window overlap into AW/AM being off suspension.


Now that all thats out of the way, F/V raid started around 5pm CST and killed Xygoz, Trak and Talendor before heading to ToV where telk had been left up. So the particular video that a few of you saw occurred after Rustle/Anon and CSG had been in ToV most of the day killing everything that was up (quite a few dragons, i think rustle/anon bagged about 8 before this point). As soon as F/V zoned into ToV all the Rustle at west exit zoned out/left leaving Anon at west exit. Telk was engaged by anon and stalled at west exit for approximately 2-3 minutes. (AW/AM on suspension)

People on F/V side were frustrated and what you heard was based on that, also don't confuse some members talking shit with officers making decisions for the alliance. Guilds on this server have a me me me mentality. If it is up we must kill it whether we need the loot or not. Whether there has been a fair rotation or not. Apparently 8 dragons, most jointly killed with Rustle, wasn't enough and they really needed this telk to complete their day.

I think that I can safely say that even if AW/AM weren't here the existing guilds would merge into those roles in short order people would flock to join the ranks of the guilds getting the ftes/kills and soon they would have enough people to contest everything at any hour just like the situation we are already in. Overall, a sad state of affairs.

Additionally, those of you nerds that have the time to monitor and follow youtube accounts and look for these videos need to get a life, step outdoors, enjoy your family and do some self-reflection on what your role in the world is and what kind of person you really want to be.

wow what a mess! Thanks for the insight

[Bones]

Originally Posted by paroxysmal [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think that I can safely say that even if AW/AM weren't here the existing guilds would merge into those roles in short order people would flock to join the ranks of the guilds getting the ftes/kills and soon they would have enough people to contest everything at any hour just like the situation we are already in. Overall, a sad state of affairs.

Additionally, those of you nerds that have the time to monitor and follow youtube accounts and look for these videos need to get a life, step outdoors, enjoy your family and do some self-reflection on what your role in the world is and what kind of person you really want to be.

what is this " step outdoors" you speak of? Is it a spell like Shadow Step? Also, I visit my family in Neriak all the time.

[Sancta]

Originally Posted by paroxysmal [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think that I can safely say that even if AW/AM weren't here the existing guilds would merge into those roles in short order people would flock to join the ranks of the guilds getting the ftes/kills and soon they would have enough people to contest everything at any hour just like the situation we are already in. Overall, a sad state of affairs.

A tale that's been around since internet dragons have existed

[FreshPrinceOfP99]

Originally Posted by paroxysmal [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Some information for those of you not really sure exactly what has been going on with the rotations that have been worked out when guilds are on suspension.

The first arranged rotation went very well with all parties working to ensure that all guilds were included and got an equal participation based on their typical raid numbers. Kittens/Infernus/Divinity accidentally left out but a few targets were set aside by each of the original parties involved in the rotation to give up to latecomers. (aw/am both on suspension)

The second arranged rotation went well with aftermath taking slightly more than the other guilds and also wanting certain mobs to be left to race for and working on their PR. AM - F/V relations challenged with the contestation and successful kill of trakanon #3 which popped after AW came off suspension, but had been listed as a F/V mob on the rotation sheet, by AM. Training occurred and was caught on video with AM at fault and two trak teeth were negotiated as concession for wrongdoing on AM part with attempted cordial finality to the event and further cooperation in the future and mentioned potential inclusion in trak rotation if it were to occurr again. (aw on suspension)

The third (attempted) arranged rotation went fairly poorly with aftermath stating that they did not want to rotate at all to start with. Getsome negotiated for some mobs to be set aside for rotation purposes. This resulted in AM getting 25 mobs by default and the leftovers were divied out to the other parties participating. CSG attempted to negotiate better terms (more mobs to be set aside for racing vs defaulting in AM's pile) and were turned down and CSG was technically blamed for the lack of a rotation during this period. AM was also demanding a 12 hour time limit on other guilds mobs vs. 24 hours from previous rotations before they became FFA. I think it is also important to note that I gave Detoxx a hard time for their lack of cooperation and fairness in rotating this round of suspensions which also contributed to the rotation not being set into place; additionally Detoxx had brought up formerly closed and cordially resolved trak/training issue from second suspension rotation period in negotiations with Getsome. Due to CSG negotiation and my interference Getsome stepped out of the negotiation role during this rotation attempt. It is also important to note that Rustle did do some joint raids with AM during this rotation period, however, all other mobs were all raced for and none were rotated. (aw on suspension)

The fourth (current) suspension period started with Getsome being statedly unavailable to start negotiations, however, became available shortly after KT was fte'd by AG and killed by CSG after the suspension period had began but before a rotation was in place. Additionally, Rustle killed gorenaire. Ideally we would have been able to get the rotation started prior to any guilds beginning to fte and kill targets. Between rustle/csg they wanted statue tormax dain doz ltk vulak be left alone. Old world/kunark mobs set to FFA. Nearly 16 hours later still no rotation in place nor a cease fire. Finally a rotation is starting to be worked on for NToV only (at midnight CST). these are the mobs not being touched by rustle/csg: Telk. Eashen iki aary dagarn cekenar zlexak sevalak lady n Jorlleag fesh. Lady m as long as non-CSG/Rustle guilds leave statue tormax dain doz ltk vulak alone. Rustle left Xygoz up in VP for f/v but did not mandate that other guilds not engage it and also stated it must be killed by 7pm EST. Rustle/CSG using firm negotiating tactics to strong arm stating that if they don't get what they want we will just do FTE racing for everything. (Fairly similar to what AM did on the third suspension period).

Timeline:
3/19 10am CST Sirken posts suspensions
3/19 10am-5pm attempts made to start negotiation
3/19 5pm-12am CST attempts made to work out a rotation (several dragons/mobs downed during this 10a-12a period, F/V downed Aary and Cekenar and attempted Jor but it got late and packed up for the night)
3/20 Rustle/Anon & CSG begin killing everything in ToV regardless of the agreement to leave said mobs alone - 4pm window coming for window overlap into AW/AM being off suspension.


Now that all thats out of the way, F/V raid started around 5pm CST and killed Xygoz, Trak and Talendor before heading to ToV where telk had been left up. So the particular video that a few of you saw occurred after Rustle/Anon and CSG had been in ToV most of the day killing everything that was up (quite a few dragons, i think rustle/anon bagged about 8 before this point). As soon as F/V zoned into ToV all the Rustle at west exit zoned out/left leaving Anon at west exit. Telk was engaged by anon and stalled at west exit for approximately 2-3 minutes. (AW/AM on suspension)

People on F/V side were frustrated and what you heard was based on that, also don't confuse some members talking shit with officers making decisions for the alliance. Guilds on this server have a me me me mentality. If it is up we must kill it whether we need the loot or not. Whether there has been a fair rotation or not. Apparently 8 dragons, most jointly killed with Rustle, wasn't enough and they really needed this telk to complete their day.

I think that I can safely say that even if AW/AM weren't here the existing guilds would merge into those roles in short order people would flock to join the ranks of the guilds getting the ftes/kills and soon they would have enough people to contest everything at any hour just like the situation we are already in. Overall, a sad state of affairs.

Additionally, those of you nerds that have the time to monitor and follow youtube accounts and look for these videos need to get a life, step outdoors, enjoy your family and do some self-reflection on what your role in the world is and what kind of person you really want to be.

What is this trickery? how are you recording dragons in ToV while you're at Fear Golems?! mind blown.

[Pezy]

Originally Posted by paroxysmal [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The fourth (current) suspension period started with Getsome being statedly unavailable to start negotiations, however, became available shortly after KT was fte'd by AG and killed by CSG after the suspension period had began but before a rotation was in place.

You left out the part where CSG broke the raid rules when killing that KT. Sirken was also there, watching. Will they be held to the same standards as A/A? Time will tell!

[Sun Mar 19 21:47:24 2017] King Tormax shouts, 'Those who raise arms against me will suffer my wrath!
[Sun Mar 19 21:47:24 2017] King Tormax engages Sadiki! <-- First FTE message (CSG)
[Sun Mar 19 21:47:46 2017] King Tormax engages Phlip!
[Sun Mar 19 22:29:50 2017] King Tormax engages Atomicous!
[Sun Mar 19 22:32:37 2017] King Tormax engages Rhaszar!
[Sun Mar 19 22:32:57 2017] King Tormax engages Phlip!
[Sun Mar 19 22:33:00 2017] King Tormax engages Painiac!
[Sun Mar 19 22:34:30 2017] King Tormax engages Rhaszar!
[Sun Mar 19 22:35:35 2017] King Tormax engages Atomicous!
[Sun Mar 19 22:36:02 2017] King Tormax engages Rhaszar!
[Sun Mar 19 22:36:07 2017] King Tormax engages Hollowlung!
[Sun Mar 19 22:36:35 2017] King Tormax engages Atomicous!
[Sun Mar 19 22:37:23 2017] King Tormax engages Atomicous!
[Sun Mar 19 22:37:41 2017] King Tormax engages Painiac!
[Sun Mar 19 22:37:57 2017] King Tormax engages Hematoma!
[Sun Mar 19 22:38:19 2017] King Tormax engages Atomicous!
[Sun Mar 19 22:38:48 2017] King Tormax engages Phlip!
[Sun Mar 19 22:38:52 2017] King Tormax engages Hematoma!
[Sun Mar 19 22:39:31 2017] King Tormax engages Phlip!
[Sun Mar 19 22:39:40 2017] King Tormax engages Atomicous!
[Sun Mar 19 22:40:12 2017] King Tormax engages Hollowlung!
[Sun Mar 19 22:40:21 2017] King Tormax engages Hematoma!
[Sun Mar 19 22:41:12 2017] King Tormax engages Painiac!
[Sun Mar 19 22:41:39 2017] King Tormax engages Atomicous!
[Sun Mar 19 22:42:11 2017] King Tormax engages Atomicous!
[Sun Mar 19 22:42:34 2017] King Tormax engages Painiac!
[Sun Mar 19 22:44:35 2017] King Tormax engages Painiac!
[Sun Mar 19 22:45:39 2017] King Tormax engages Atomicous!
[Sun Mar 19 22:50:03 2017] King Tormax engages Painiac! <-- WHOOPS! Over 60 minutes now!
[Sun Mar 19 22:50:19 2017] King Tormax engages Phlip!
[Sun Mar 19 22:50:21 2017] King Tormax engages Paridox! <-- Final engage, pull, and kill

Originally Posted by Sirken

If your guild/raid does not kill the FTE'd target within the allotted hour, when that hour expires, the target is considered open (not engaged) and can be FTE'd by anyone (except the guild that just had FTE), and then that new guild/raid with FTE will have an hour to make an attempt at killing the mob.