I know it's not classic, but...

[cd288]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What they "should have" isn't really relevant on a 10 year old server stuck on the same timeline.

A lot of people twink their characters, and Silver Chitin Hand Wraps + Staff of Battle is like 700pp for both on Blue lol.

Oh wow so you're doing your moving the goalposts thing again. Your original position across threads has been "Warriors are better DPS than charmed mobs"

Now when someone points out how your argument is flawed and your parses are cherry-picked useless data, you move the goalposts to "a twinked out warrior is better DPS than charmed mobs"

Well boys, let's settle in for the long haul here because we all know what's about to happen. We're going to get a 300 page thread with 1k posts from DSM where he shifts his argument 100 times. Getting the popcorn ready again.

[Danth]

Originally Posted by cd288 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So a lot of writing to say exactly what I said, which is that twinkled warriors might be somewhat viable. Like you said overleveled weapons that aren’t realistic that someone of that level should actually have

Well, yeah, I'll try to post at times even when in broad agreement because it helps counteract the natural tendency towards forum negativity, disagreement being a frequent driving force of forum discussions.

As for how realistic it is for someone to have out-leveled equipment, depends on where you're at. P1999, today, Green or Blue both, it's plenty realistic and probably nearer than not to standard. Fresh server, new Green, they're going to have those 6/26 axes if even anything that high or mighty.

Danth

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Danth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Well, yeah, I'll try to post at times even when in broad agreement because it helps counteract the natural tendency towards forum negativity, disagreement being a frequent driving force of forum discussions.

As for how realistic it is for someone to have out-leveled equipment, depends on where you're at. P1999, today, Green or Blue both, it's plenty realistic and probably nearer than not to standard. Fresh server, new Green, they're going to have those 6/26 axes if even anything that high or mighty.

Danth

Exactly. OP didn't specify the timeline, and it sounds like he is referring to the current time. On a fresh server Enchanters will obviously do better than a Warrior, because good ratio weapons and haste items are not easy to come by in Vanilla. But in that situation you put up with helping Warriors level because you need them when Kunark drops.

[PlsNoBan]

I have leveled every EQ class to 50+ for the record. Some many times over. Lots of them twinked fairly heavily. I've done enchanter EASILY 5+ times 50+ across multiple servers including original classic back in the day, p99, multiple TLP's. I feel like I have a pretty good understanding of this game as a whole and the power levels of various classes. Enchanter especially. No random one off parse is going to change my mind.

[Toxigen]

Originally Posted by PlsNoBan [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I have leveled every EQ class to 50+ for the record. Some many times over. Lots of them twinked fairly heavily. I've done enchanter EASILY 5+ times 50+ across multiple servers including original classic back in the day, p99, multiple TLP's. I feel like I have a pretty good understanding of this game as a whole and the power levels of various classes. Enchanter especially. No random one off parse is going to change my mind.

I think if I ever come back I'm going to de-level Toxigen to 5 and get some sweet solo logs for DSM to sperg over.

[cd288]

Originally Posted by PlsNoBan [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I have leveled every EQ class to 50+ for the record. Some many times over. Lots of them twinked fairly heavily. I've done enchanter EASILY 5+ times 50+ across multiple servers including original classic back in the day, p99, multiple TLP's. I feel like I have a pretty good understanding of this game as a whole and the power levels of various classes. Enchanter especially. No random one off parse is going to change my mind.

Yeah I mean the thing with a one off parse is it's useless in an RNG game like classic EQ.

There are times where the RNG is just gonna go against what the general trend should be. Like if you did 1,000 parses I bet you there's gonna be like 200 (just using a very rough guess) where the warrior out DPSes a charmed and hasted mob. It just happens sometimes because it's RNG.

You also need to factor in any buffs the warrior may have had along with the specific mob's (both the enemy mob in both cases, and the charmed mob's) overall stats. You also need to look at the Warrior's STR, which can be increased significantly with gear that people would probably not call "twink" gear. But anyway, we've been over all this with respect to DSM's parses before. He takes one parse, provides minimal details, and then goes "TeH dAtA pRoVeS mE rIgHt guyessss". It's not useful data.

Thankfully he isn't involved in any sort of important profession that affects our lives, such as scientific trials, otherwise we could be in deep trouble.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by PlsNoBan [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I have leveled every EQ class to 50+ for the record. Some many times over. Lots of them twinked fairly heavily. I've done enchanter EASILY 5+ times 50+ across multiple servers including original classic back in the day, p99, multiple TLP's. I feel like I have a pretty good understanding of this game as a whole and the power levels of various classes. Enchanter especially. No random one off parse is going to change my mind.

The only thing that matters for this thread is what the P99 data shows today. It could very well have felt different during live, for example, because most people had crap gear. You didn't have a lot of Warriors with a weapon like Wurmslayer, or a good haste item.

It could have even been a bit different when you leveled your Enchanter on P99 if it was years ago.

[PlsNoBan]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The only thing that matters for this thread is what the P99 data shows today. It could very well have felt different during live, for example, because most people had crap gear. You didn't have a lot of Warriors with a weapon like Wurmslayer, or a good haste item.

It could have even been a bit different when you leveled your Enchanter on P99 if it was years ago.

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[unsunghero]

I have seen so many twinked monks (I assume twinked) as I was leveling, that it made the monk class seem like the most broken in the game

I’d be thinking I was OP soloing stuff in Sol B on enc, then some monk would come in who was 5 levels lower than me and be wrecking stuff doing fast hits of like 120 damage, killing much faster than me since I was relying on a charmed mob that’s whiffing like crazy miss miss miss miss miss “wow this shit is boring why can’t they hit each other”, meanwhile the monk has killed like 3 mobs at 5 levels lower than me

Only now in around the mid-50’s have charmed mobs been able to match the twinked monk’s damage, but I bet they still aren’t swinging as fast or hitting as often without buffs

[PlsNoBan]

Originally Posted by unsunghero [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I have seen so many twinked monks (I assume twinked) as I was leveling, that it made the monk class seem like the most broken in the game

I’d be thinking I was OP soloing stuff in Sol B on enc, then some monk would come in who was 5 levels lower than me and be wrecking stuff doing fast hits of like 120 damage, killing much faster than me since I was relying on a charmed mob that’s whiffing like crazy miss miss miss miss miss “wow this shit is boring why can’t they hit each other”, meanwhile the monk has killed like 3 mobs at 5 levels lower than me

Only now in around the mid-50’s have charmed mobs been able to match the twinked monk’s damage, but I bet they still aren’t swinging as fast or hitting as often without buffs

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No mention whether your charms are hasted/weaponized or if they have any pet toys. I can probably see a heavily twinked monk outdamaging a charm if it's not hasted and doesn't have weapons. Those monks could have CoF and be fully buffed with fungi tunics for all we know. Not really a fair comparison and lots of unknown variables. Also this just in: Monks do more damage than warriors