Playing bard in group

[Terrel]

Originally Posted by DMN [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Nope. It depends on a bunch of factors if its worth it to charm or not, not simple "don't charm in group" dogmatism. Your "group" might only be 2-3 people. You could be sitting there waiting for spawns because the area has been broken already or you could be just breaking the area where caster/healer mana is vital to the groups efficacy.. You could be sitting there in a group of fully twinked characters dump trucking everything or non twinks plodding along. Party class composition, mob types, and many other f things play into it..

DMN and Wallicker are correct. Charm can be a nice addition in your arsenal during grouping, but it is situational. It adds to group DPS in bursts.

If you're charming a secondary mob when the target mob is at 10%, you're doing it wrong. If you're charming a secondary mob when the target mob is at 100% and it takes 30 seconds to kill it, you're doing it right. And oh, btw....if you have to wait 5 seconds at the end of charm for it to break? That's off of the 9 seconds that the charmed mob gained you by adding it's DPS. You're now 4 seconds to the good! (That's the actual math[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.])

And when you get a hit a few times after charm breaks? No problem! You're a bard, and with your super regen, you'll be back at full HP by the time the next mob is in camp. And so will most of your group.

[astuce999]

I would like to hear more about a few things:

-the 20 seconds charm

-the charm that breaks early

-the angry ex-charmed pet

-the extra tick on mez with a flute

-FT and bards

It's fascinating.

cheers,

Astuce

[Legidias]

Pull 3 mobs. Group fights one, charmed mob fights other mob. Bard can even twist with instruments for group regen / haste while basically being their own charm kiting solo.

Kill first mob, clean up 20% hp 2 other mobs.

ez pz lemon squeezy.

[Galenbor]

A few points about Bard group play, particularly regarding charm;

Charming is indeed situational when in a group. A full group with a charming class (Necro/Chanter/Druid) easily turns into confusion if you start charming as a Bard. Because Bard charm works differently in several ways aside from the short duration.

- Bard charm wipes all but 1 point of aggro on the Bard. It's a memblur in this case, and in fact after Bard takes a swipe from his former pet, next one on hate list gets it. Try dropping charm next to the sitting caster who annoyed you. Or use it to save a Shaman or Chanter with a lot of aggro from mez, slow etc. the attention he's due shortly from a pissed off mob.

- All charm spells breaks duration spells cast by NPCs, like Slow and DoTs. For a Bard charm with above exceptions in mind, this turns otherwise annoying or downright nasty spells into a short inconvenience.

- Some times, charm is the only option to stopping a mob from dealing damage, like caster giants, or most mobs in Skyfire. Can't mez'em, can't root'em and stop them nuking. Charm at least stops them cold for a duration while other stuff is handled.

- Finaly, best use of charm tends for me to come in small groups or duos, especially if there's a root capable class involved. The Cluster Charming (bunch of mobs rooted in melee range, charm one after the other) is a firm favourite for fun and effective tactic. Cleared trains in KC that chased full groups to zoneline with just a Ranger buddy, who it has to be said is well aware of the silly stuff I like to pull and thus on the ball. Remember you can use your mez to push rooted mobs that end up out of melee range, just turn your facing to adjust the direction (Twilight pulls, so face away from the direction you need).

Have fun and remember, a well played Bard is a true asset to any group, if you get told to bring out weapons and just play mana song, it's perhaps a good time to look for another group.

[Terrel]

Originally Posted by Galenbor [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

A few points about Bard group play, particularly regarding charm;

Charming is indeed situational when in a group. A full group with a charming class (Necro/Chanter/Druid) easily turns into confusion if you start charming as a Bard. Because Bard charm works differently in several ways aside from the short duration.

- Bard charm wipes all but 1 point of aggro on the Bard. It's a memblur in this case, and in fact after Bard takes a swipe from his former pet, next one on hate list gets it. Try dropping charm next to the sitting caster who annoyed you. Or use it to save a Shaman or Chanter with a lot of aggro from mez, slow etc. the attention he's due shortly from a pissed off mob.

- All charm spells breaks duration spells cast by NPCs, like Slow and DoTs. For a Bard charm with above exceptions in mind, this turns otherwise annoying or downright nasty spells into a short inconvenience.

- Some times, charm is the only option to stopping a mob from dealing damage, like caster giants, or most mobs in Skyfire. Can't mez'em, can't root'em and stop them nuking. Charm at least stops them cold for a duration while other stuff is handled.

- Finaly, best use of charm tends for me to come in small groups or duos, especially if there's a root capable class involved. The Cluster Charming (bunch of mobs rooted in melee range, charm one after the other) is a firm favourite for fun and effective tactic. Cleared trains in KC that chased full groups to zoneline with just a Ranger buddy, who it has to be said is well aware of the silly stuff I like to pull and thus on the ball. Remember you can use your mez to push rooted mobs that end up out of melee range, just turn your facing to adjust the direction (Twilight pulls, so face away from the direction you need).

Have fun and remember, a well played Bard is a true asset to any group, if you get told to bring out weapons and just play mana song, it's perhaps a good time to look for another group.

All great points, and all accurate! Always keep charm memmed. Rooted while pulling? Np...charm the rooter, and viola, you're free!

[Troxx]

Charm is a great tool. It has limitations and the user has to be careful not to bone-headedly charm a target within 18-24 seconds of expected engage time.

[Karok]

Do flowing thought items work with bards? I thought at this expansion level they don’t.

[Legidias]

Yes

[DMN]

Originally Posted by Jauna [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I never once seen a necro click off lich with non-lute cantina on and if they have lich and cantina they have mana to tap back whatever. and shaman will get full mana long before their health is in danger because most likely they will have their self regen on with possible racial or item regen.

Necros/shaman are almost always able to make the most of extra health. Even if necros are not losing life with lich they can shadowbond for 7 ticks, costing 20 mana and giving someone around 900 hit points at the cost of 500 of their own. That's like 400 hp net heal for 20 mana. That's over 300% more mana efficient healing than torpor and no debuffs. Shaman's use for extra hp is so obvious it doesn't need mentioning.

[zanderklocke]

Efficiency aside, is the individual having more fun meleeing or using instruments? That's the real question. What is the level of fun added per choice?

You can also melee while holding only an instrument and do both!