Monks - The second best tank in the game?

[Detoxx]

Originally Posted by AzzarTheGod [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

intredasting... any blue fellows have any numbers on this? Or is it not common practice on your server.

I don't have the data on my phone but I have broken 1630 attack and out dps Rogues with Claws of Lightning on the regular. I've done over 120 dps on raid mobs like King Tormax, Vindi, Most north ToV dragons.

1630 attack is so stupidly disgusting. That combined with precision is literally untouchable, berserk or not. I believe on the King Tormax I did 127 dps, landed 590 hits with the next highest being a rogue at like 300 hits.

[AzzarTheGod]

Originally Posted by Detoxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

1630 attack is so stupidly disgusting.

Yeah that sounds pretty gross...I feel like I had less than 1550 attack in Planes of Power/Early GoD on my rogue with EPlanes/Time mix.

[Detoxx]

Originally Posted by AzzarTheGod [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yeah that sounds pretty gross...I feel like I had less than 1550 attack in Planes of Power/Early GoD on my rogue with EPlanes/Time mix.

Yeah that's maximum effort though. Call of the Predator, Strength of Nature, 3 Aura of Battles (vindi bp, dain belt, doze mask), Avatar, Blue Sword (basically another Avatar) and bard songs / epic proc. I've heard that rogues didn't break 1600 til after PoP but wasn't sure.

[Lhancelot]

So, essentially what I have gotten from all the information here on monks is this:

1. When top geared, a monk can tank not only effectively for a group but better than the tanking classes due to extreme skill caps, avoidance, blocks, and defensive abilities sk/pals do not have. And besides not having a taunt button, a monk can hold aggro just as well as a warrior when in top-end gears.

2. When not in top-gears, a tanking monk can struggle with aggro, and so for lesser equipped monks, or group members not able to manage the aggro problems a monk could have a paladin or sk is better. A warrior might be better only because they do have taunt.

3. If a group manages with a lesser geared monk or one that isn't all that great at tanking, that group probably would do just as well with a ranger, bard, or any other melee that has some ways to hold aggro and can manage to take hits.

That's what I seem to understand regarding monks, tanking, and groups. Is that a fair assessment then?

[maskedmelon]

Mostly naked monk can tank up through KC with a shaman. Substitute cleric for healer and will probably have down time because most clerics will continue to waste mana on divine light rather than ch the monk. It's like their brains are broken and have reserved CH for war/pal/sk. Also absence of slow can make healing more challenging, but still not impossible. Add a necro to the retard cleric and the lack of slow becomes no problem again. OR boot the stupid cleric and roll with two necro. Not all clerics are awful of course ^^

Paladin is incredibly fabuloso when you are in a bad group, particularly one without a monk. It is amazing how much a good paladin can augment a bad group. If you are in a good group, you've no need of a paladin. Same goes for shadow Knights.

Warriors are useful for when your monk is your only melee, so that the monk can continue pulling while the warrior finishes tanking. If you have two monks, warrior not so useful, though they will make ch more efficient and if you are grouped with a retarded cleric, they may actually use it.

Generally speaking though, if you are in a group with a couple of super rogues who can't (and really shouldn't) restrain themselves and monk doesn't have sufficient aggro proc (AC, SWH, TStaff), then get a ranger. They will mitigate more poorly, but will offer better damage than a pal/sk and best snap aggro outside a bard who would work equally well if you don't have another haste/slower already.

[Erati]

1600 very high, like you said you need Bard songs, Bard epic, Ranger buff etc etc etc

post them parses !

[Erati]

Originally Posted by Lhancelot [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So, essentially what I have gotten from all the information here on monks is this:

1. When top geared, a monk can tank not only effectively for a group but better than the tanking classes due to extreme skill caps, avoidance, blocks, and defensive abilities sk/pals do not have. And besides not having a taunt button, a monk can hold aggro just as well as a warrior when in top-end gears.

2. When not in top-gears, a tanking monk can struggle with aggro, and so for lesser equipped monks, or group members not able to manage the aggro problems a monk could have a paladin or sk is better. A warrior might be better only because they do have taunt.

3. If a group manages with a lesser geared monk or one that isn't all that great at tanking, that group probably would do just as well with a ranger, bard, or any other melee that has some ways to hold aggro and can manage to take hits.

That's what I seem to understand regarding monks, tanking, and groups. Is that a fair assessment then?

Monk aggro should never be an issue in a small group setting unless you have a rogue with you who doesnt know how to evade.

Tstaff would fix most aggro issues tho even if you are around bad group mates

[Daldaen]

Dunno why DPS is being discussed but I once saw a monk tank Dain Frostreaver IV. It was a magical sight, as the raid began to panic when Warriors were getting banished and not returned, a bold monk said "don't worry guys, I've got this", using his entire puppet strings to secure aggro and tanked the Dain for probably 60%.

Monks are so OP on this server it's ridiculous. They were properly nerfed in their mitigation during Luclin and PoP, keeping their avoidance values. It was a good era for balance but we unfortunately don't have those expansions. Yet.

[Loke]

Originally Posted by AzzarTheGod [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yeah that sounds pretty gross...I feel like I had less than 1550 attack in Planes of Power/Early GoD on my rogue with EPlanes/Time mix.

This sounds wrong. PoP was a huge increase in ATK items. I think worn ATK was capped at 250 from items, but with beastlord buffs I remember my elemental planes geared rog was able to break 2k easily. I quit before we really got in to PoTime, so that was just with elemental gear. I wanna say fully raid buffed was somewhere in the 2100-2300 range.

[Daldaen]

The worn ATK cap for gear was +250. The unbuffed ATK cap for rangers in PoP was 1620. Monks/Rogues/Beast/Warriors was 1566.

But on top of those worn values, you'd have things like bard War March, Symphony of Battle clicky from PoTime, among other things you didn't have available pre-PoP. So over 2000 ATK was definitely attainable with buffage.