Lols TMO

[Hitpoint]

A lot of what goes on these days in the raid scene is ridiculous though. One ridiculous thing pays back another. It's still better than it used to be, imo.

[YendorLootmonkey]

Originally Posted by Fael [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

When four members of a guild are farming gorillas in fear, for their own benefit and one of them intentionally does something illegal that doesn't constituent guild action. How hard is that for you dumbasses to understand.

Because doing illegal shit was supposed to have a punishment so severe, it would serve as an effective deterrent against intentional training which -- with a rational/reasonable playerbase -- would drastically reduce the amount of instances of this happening that a GM would have to get involved with.

Under which scenario is an individual least likely to train another raid intentionally?

a) Well, if I get caught in Fraps, I may or may not get punished, and if I do, it's just me. I eat a week suspension. Maybe kicked out of my guild. Is it worth it?

b) Well, if I get caught in Fraps, my ENTIRE GUILD gets raid suspended for at least a week. They will all fucking hate me, and I will get kicked out of my guild. Is it worth it?

If we're conveniently no longer calling armor clears in Fear or Hate a "raid" for the purposes of rules-lawyers trying to mitigate what happened here, then are armor clears in Fear or Hate prohibited as part of being "suspended from raiding" or are they still fair game for a raid-suspended guild?

I'm sincerely asking for clarification... the punishment/rules seemingly change so much around here depending on which guild gets caught doing something illegal, I honestly don't recall.

[Socratic]

There is a huge difference between a guild as a whole breaking the rules and doing something illegal as a raid, vs. 1-2 people acting on their own and doing something like training/logging in at the wrong spot.

One warrants guild suspension, the other warrants a lesser punishment (usually involving whatever encounter the infraction is centered around, or merely individual suspensions).

It's the underlying principle behind "reasonable" attempts at recompense.

[YendorLootmonkey]

Originally Posted by Socratic [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

There is a huge difference between a guild as a whole breaking the rules and doing something illegal as a raid, vs. 1-2 people acting on their own and doing something like training/logging in at the wrong spot.

I would argue that too if my guild were just found guilty of raid interference.

[Baldwinning]

your guild just were

[doyoueventrainbro]

Originally Posted by YendorLootmonkey [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Because doing illegal shit was supposed to have a punishment so severe, it would serve as an effective deterrent against intentional training which -- with a rational/reasonable playerbase -- would drastically reduce the amount of instances of this happening that a GM would have to get involved with.

Under which scenario is an individual least likely to train another raid intentionally?

a) Well, if I get caught in Fraps, I may or may not get punished, and if I do, it's just me. I eat a week suspension. Maybe kicked out of my guild. Is it worth it?

b) Well, if I get caught in Fraps, my ENTIRE GUILD gets raid suspended for at least a week. They will all fucking hate me, and I will get kicked out of my guild. Is it worth it?

If we're conveniently no longer calling armor clears in Fear or Hate a "raid" for the purposes of rules-lawyers trying to mitigate what happened here, then are armor clears in Fear or Hate prohibited as part of being "suspended from raiding" or are they still fair game for a raid-suspended guild?

I'm sincerely asking for clarification... the punishment/rules seemingly change so much around here depending on which guild gets caught doing something illegal, I honestly don't recall.

Seriously, some staff member please clarify what Yendor is asking for clarification on. I think A LOT of the raiding player base want to know.

[Socratic]

All 3 of the guilds suspended fit. When unreasonable people try to equate the two very different classes of events it doesn't work, as it hasn't worked here. Good luck trying to argue that some scrub doing something stupid on his own should warrant the same punishment as your guild KS'ing and looting someone else's raid mob, then trying to argue ignorance in an attempt to keep the loot.

No one reasonable will go along for the ride.

[Lazie]

Originally Posted by Man0warr [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

4? Lazie said you guys had up to 9 TMO at one point.

I said one group. I thinks logs show that as well. It Fluctuated between 4 and 6 people.

[doyoueventrainbro]

Originally Posted by Lazie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I said one group. I thinks logs show that as well. It Fluctuated between 4 and 6 people.

So where is the line? It's ok to train people if you have 4-6 guild members in a zone?

Is it ok to KS a a draco or something with 3 wizards then and no penalty towards the guild they are aligned in?

Where's the line, bro?

[DeruIsLove]

Originally Posted by YendorLootmonkey [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Because doing illegal shit was supposed to have a punishment so severe, it would serve as an effective deterrent against intentional training which -- with a rational/reasonable playerbase -- would drastically reduce the amount of instances of this happening that a GM would have to get involved with.

Under which scenario is an individual least likely to train another raid intentionally?

a) Well, if I get caught in Fraps, I may or may not get punished, and if I do, it's just me. I eat a week suspension. Maybe kicked out of my guild. Is it worth it?

b) Well, if I get caught in Fraps, my ENTIRE GUILD gets raid suspended for at least a week. They will all fucking hate me, and I will get kicked out of my guild. Is it worth it?

If we're conveniently no longer calling armor clears in Fear or Hate a "raid" for the purposes of rules-lawyers trying to mitigate what happened here, then are armor clears in Fear or Hate prohibited as part of being "suspended from raiding" or are they still fair game for a raid-suspended guild?

I'm sincerely asking for clarification... the punishment/rules seemingly change so much around here depending on which guild gets caught doing something illegal, I honestly don't recall.

So if it's B, I can join up into a guild I actually don't like, leech some perks for a whole and then when I get sick of it I can 'do something stupid' and get the whole guild kicked from the raid pool for a while?

IIIIIINTERESTING! [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]