Discussion: PvP Deaths (Item/Coin/XP Loot/Gain)

[Xareth]

Originally Posted by Billbike [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think this would be fun:

Have only 1 of each of these items on the server.
Make them all/all, no lvl req
Make them too big to fit in a bag
Make them player lootable upon pvp death, announce it serverwide in yellow text
Make the holder of the item distinguishable by having a title, or illusion

And you can't camp while the item is in your possession.

[Damaja]

One thing to remember, this isn't LIVE, this is Free Shard EQ so you make it too rough people have no reason to stay. I have played on nothing but PvP servers in every game I have ever played in so I have been around. Item loot was a BLAST but in the end most people ended up hating it. XP loss will end up promoting hard core griefing which will also runn people off, just make it coin loot. The corpse run plus coin loot will be enough to make it worth it.

If the server is more guild vs guild, that in itself will maintain the population strickly from the unity of guilds fighting other guilds. There needs to be a honor system among the players, allow corpse runs as long as there announced in ooc or whatever, enforce loot and scoot aka LnS and make it there needs to be an hour before the person can return to the zone. It may sound funny or even dumb to some but having a code of honor among the players themselves that is ENFORCED by the players will go a long way in maintaining the stability of the server.

[Silikten]

Originally Posted by Damaja [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

but having a code of honor among the players themselves that is ENFORCED by the players will go a long way in maintaining the stability of the server.

this ^^

[greatdane]

If you want the server to maintain an actual gameplay environment alongside its PvP scene, itemloot is pretty much out of the question. That hasn't really worked since way back in the day where people hadn't yet figured out that it's so contrary to the core gameplay of Everquest. If dying in PvP means losing your best item, there's no incentive to do what the entire game was designed for, and it would turn the server into a meaningless PvP arena. In order for the PvP to flourish and sustain itself, it needs a purpose, and that purpose is to win the rights to a camp/zone/raid or to build up your "PvP career" through accomplishments. Itemloot will just encourage griefing and create an uncontrollably hostile atmosphere while deterring most players from participating in what forms the foundation of the abovementioned purposes.

XP loss can work, but I would suggest limiting it to something like once or twice an hour so that fucktards won't jizz their pants from bind-camping some hapless newbie from level 30 to 20. Coin loot is fine. Most of the incentive for PvP should be in the fame and accomplishment of success, and the privilege to "own" a part of the game world for as long as you can conquer and defend it. Nothing that ruins characters, that was for games like UO where your character wasn't the result of months of hard work.

[Galacticus]

Originally Posted by Rogean [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

We are leaning towards a server with no item or coin loot, however there will be an XP Loss on PvP Deaths. We are open to discussion on this.

I think we have leant enough.

[Yukahwa]

Greatdane your argument doesn't hold up against the reality of item loot servers like Rallos Zek.

I don't like the fact that without item loot, it will be a race to level 50, a race to get the best items, and then make a twink at whatever level you want to dominate and you never have to think twice about that twink again, he is maxed out and almost impossible to kill. It doesn't require skill to do this, it just requires miserably surpassing those lowbie levels once and then camping all the junk you want. It means level 1-50 for first timers that hit the game a month after server release will be a miserable time simply avoiding these nonpunishable twinks and their whole goal will be to get to level 50 so they can start having a fighting chance too.

Not good. If anything is bad for server population, it is that. For those players, PVP without item loot is basically PVE except you also get killed by a twink in unrest sometimes. Whats the point? You dont get HUGE exp for killing a hugely hard to kill twink, and he'll be right back anyways.. so its just a nuisance. When you have a possibility to steal that rubicite BP its actually worth fighting back.

[Foxx]

item loot without pvp is actually the same as PVE except u get to compete and fight each other for camps, mobs, raids etc etc.... not just whatever group of losers have sat there for the last 100 hours.

perfect example was on kunark release on p99, when some guild (i forget which) just sat in the crypt in sebilis for over a week, just rotating players in the group not allowing anyone else to go there.. with pvp, you get to go kill them (or try to) and whoever is better gets the camp.

[Haul]

No coin loot is not rational.

[Yukahwa]

Foxx - You are totally right.

However, thats the only advantage of Non loot pvp. At level 50 (or 60 depending on the era) contested camps can be settled in a rational violent PVP manner. Its a great thing.

The problem is for folks getting into the server a month down the line trying to get to level 50. Its just not any fun getting killed for sport by a twink when there is really no incentive for you to figure out a way to overcome him.

With item loot, lowbies have strong incentive to gang together and basically make a haphazard raid on that twink for the chance of looting a piece of his sweet gear.

[trix]

I vote for exp gain on PvP kills, combined with permanent death for dying, full loot rights to ALL items and coins on the corpse including no drop, double exp rate, double drop rate for all non-common items, FFA PvP rules with no +/- level rules (anyone can kill anyone at any time anywhere), and double faction gain/lose rates.

Imagine that level 20 warrior who nobly sacrifices himself for the group. Instead of a simple "thanks dude" his sacrifice suddenly becomes much more meaningful. Worthy of remembering. Even worthy of befriending his "child" (next character he created) for life. Perhaps even looting the warrior and saving the gear for the child.

Imagine how much worthier you'd feel taking out that con yellow, knowing that failure means starting from scratch? Knowing that people even attempting to kill yellows is extremely rare.

Imagine someone kills your good friend or your roommate/brother/girlfriend/etc. Now you have real incentive to hunt them down and make certain they die for what they did. Or to pay someone to hunt them. Lives would finally have REAL WORTH!

I realize the chances of this happening are pretty much a big hell no, and that my preference is likely unpopular, but this would be my personal dream MMO. Unfortunately, there hasn't been one single MMO with the balls to run with this idea, though there have been a few half-assed attempts.

Ah well. Put me down for no xp-loss or gain and yes item and coin loot. Without permadeath xp loss is useless and xp gain is too exploitable.