Best 4 person all caster/priest group

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Vexenu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Shaman/Monk is a great duo, and throwing in an Enchanter is just icing on the cake. A strong duo + the strongest solo class will obviously be a capable trio.

But two can play at this game.

Enchanter/Cleric is even stronger duo than Shaman/Monk. And we can then throw in another Enchanter as icing, the same way you did with your duo. But since everyone knows that Enchanter/Cleric is a stronger duo than Shaman/Monk, our resulting trio of Enchanter/Enchanter/Cleric is stronger than Shaman/Monk/Enchanter.

And given that Monk is a Shaman's best duo partner, SHM/ENC/XXX/XXX (removing the Monk since this is an all priest/caster discussion) will necessarily be weaker than ENC/ENC/CLR/XXX.

Admit it, DSM. You've lost. You must now concede, apologize to the forum, rend your garments and spend three days cloaked in sackcloth and ashes, wailing in repentance for your misdeeds.

It's up to you to prove Enchanter/Cleric is better than Shaman/Enchanter! I look forward to your evidence.

[cyxthryth]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Up to you to prove it! I look forward to your evidence.

Where's your evidence that supports the below claims again? I don't see it in the hundreds/thousands of posts that you've made in this thread.
Up to you to prove you can name a camp that needs a Shaman!
Up to you to prove Shaman can/does improve a group's DPS (more than a non-epic Mage can/does) by root rotting multiple mobs parallel to the group!
I - still - look forward to your evidence.

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

As you can see, this spam and nonsense will simply continue.

Why? Instead of "spamming nonsense" you could simply provide evidence to support your claims. It really isn't hard hehe. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

cannot back up claims

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

conceding...refusing to answer

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You can keep pretending otherwise to dodge this, but everybody can see it. You concede every time you dodge like this.

Thank you for conceding you cannot back up the below claims.
You can keep attempting to dodge the below, but everybody can see it. You concede every time you dodge like this.

You "need" to provide an(y) example of a camp that "needs" a Shaman to substantiate your claim that you can name multiple camps that "need" a Shaman.

You also "need" to provide evidence that supports your tens/dozens/hundreds/thousands of posts in this thread in which you claimed that Shaman can/does improve a group's DPS (more than a non-epic Mage can/does) by root rotting multiple mobs parallel to the group.

I'm not sure if you've forgotten about these things that you claimed - if so, feel free to refresh your memory at any time by re-reading as the post history is clear and visible to all. You're simply not going to get away with making baseless, unsubstantiated claims. It's really not a good look for you.

[Elizondo]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Up to you to prove Enchanter/Cleric is better! I look forward to your evidence.

Prove to who?

We all agree

CLR / ENC better than ENC / SHM

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Elizondo [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Prove to who?

We all agree

CLR / ENC better than ENC / SHM

Agreement does not mean it is correct. Everybody could claim the sky is orange, but they would still be wrong.

[Vexenu]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It's up to you to prove Enchanter/Cleric is better than Shaman/Enchanter! I look forward to your evidence.

Shaman provides the Enchanter Malo, a slightly better slow, HP buffs, a pet to off-tank during charm breaks, SoW, heals/regen and Torpor at 60. These are solid additions to bring to a single Enchanter, and no one would say otherwise. But there are some weaknesses:

- Torpor comes very late at 60 and slows the charm pet you cast it on
- SoW can be had from potions
- Malo is good at reducing/delaying charm breaks, but ultimately doesn't stop them or do anything to help the Enchanter when they happen

Now consider what the Cleric brings to the table: the strongest heals in the game, including CH at level 39 for 20pp from a vendor (compare to Shaman Torpor at 60 and basically the most expensive/in-demand spell in the game), ranged stuns to greatly reduce risk during charm breaks, better HP buffs (for Enchanter and pet, increasing CH efficiency), lull/DA combo to make breaking dangerous camps much less risky (Shaman has absolutely nothing to compete with this, the Shaman strategy is just to watch the Enchanter die on a crit resist then log your infamous pocket Cleric), and rez when things really go south.

The basic idea behind Enchanter/Cleric is that charming and the Enchanter class in general are incredibly overpowered in EQ, and that adding the Cleric simply allows you to both 1) substantially reduce the risk and danger of charming, and 2) get the most mileage out of charm pets with the equally overpowered CH spell (which also, unlike Torpor, does not nerf your charm pet DPS).

The Shaman is a great solo class with a unique playstyle, and due to its sheer power and versatility it can duo well with pretty much any other class - but the simple fact is that a Cleric offers a unique skillset that dovetails better with the Enchanter (much in the same way that the Shaman dovetails better with the Monk).

[Elizondo]

Originally Posted by Vexenu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Shaman provides the Enchanter Malo, a slightly better slow, HP buffs, a pet to off-tank during charm breaks, SoW, heals/regen and Torpor at 60. These are solid additions to bring to a single Enchanter, and no one would say otherwise. But there are some weaknesses:

- Torpor comes very late at 60 and slows the charm pet you cast it on
- SoW can be had from potions
- Malo is good at reducing/delaying charm breaks, but ultimately doesn't stop them or do anything to help the Enchanter when they happen

Now consider what the Cleric brings to the table: the strongest heals in the game, including CH at level 39 for 20pp from a vendor (compare to Shaman Torpor at 60 and basically the most expensive/in-demand spell in the game), ranged stuns to greatly reduce risk during charm breaks, better HP buffs (for Enchanter and pet, increasing CH efficiency), lull/DA combo to make breaking dangerous camps much less risky (Shaman has absolutely nothing to compete with this, the Shaman strategy is just to watch the Enchanter die on a crit resist then log your infamous pocket Cleric), and rez when things really go south.

The basic idea behind Enchanter/Cleric is that charming and the Enchanter class in general are incredibly overpowered in EQ, and that adding the Cleric simply allows you to both 1) substantially reduce the risk and danger of charming, and 2) get the most mileage out of charm pets with the equally overpowered CH spell (which also, unlike Torpor, does not nerf your charm pet DPS).

The Shaman is a great solo class with a unique playstyle, and due to its sheer power and versatility it can duo well with pretty much any other class - but the simple fact is that a Cleric offers a unique skillset that dovetails better with the Enchanter (much in the same way that the Shaman dovetails better with the Monk).

Not to mention the cleric can rez when things go really bad

High Elf Cleric W/ Max CHA + Enc is God Tier duo

Shaman is pitiful compared to that

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Vexenu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

- Torpor comes very late at 60 and slows the charm pet

You don't understand Shamans, because you think that an Enchanter pet is tanking, and the Shaman is Torporing the pet. Thats not how it works. The Shaman tanks and torpors themselves. No need to slow the pet.

For people who want information on the benefits of Shaman/Enchanter:

https://project1999.com/forums/showp...postcount=4843

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Continuing to spam the thread doesn't make me look bad/wrong, or you look good/correct.

[Elizondo]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Continuing to spam the thread doesn't make me look bad, or you look good/correct.

lawl how many posts do you have in this thread

Unreal

ENC / CLR better than ENC / SHM btw

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Elizondo [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

lawl how many posts do you have in this thread

Unreal

ENC / CLR better than ENC / SHM btw

As you can see, this spam and nonsense will simply continue.

Originally Posted by Elizondo [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Everyone agrees with me and you agree with you

I'm fine with that

Incorrect.

Originally Posted by Swish [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Shamans are great, and the best unmentioned point here is you don't have to deal with the CH chain in a raid [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]