Proposition For Raid Rules - Input Requested

[Ungriim]

Originally Posted by Lammy [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think the main reason that everyone is haing a struggle here is that this went from the staff wanting people to clean up their behavior in the raid scene... To now, guilds that I've never even seen try to race for a mob, trying to make point based raIiding systems, rotations, etc. How is this not more work for GMs to keep track of?

its just like Democrats in our society, they want handouts at the expense of others and cause more work for our government.

why can't people just be happy to agree and respect others and the battlefield, without all the technical b******* .the larger guild can agree to make some concessions as far as leaving some targets up for the smaller guilds and everyone except TMO can take away something from these negotiations.

Once again - battered women's syndrome. The raid scene is so fucking dumb at this point that people with actual lives would rather do RL than spend 72 hours setting up for a mob that dies in 30 seconds. Where's the fun? I think people would have a lot more fun trying dragons with low numbers low gear and actual prep time when it spawns...

[Fael]

[QUOTE= I think people would have a lot more fun trying dragons with low numbers low gear and actual prep time when it spawns...[/QUOTE]

Ugrim. I know you cannot understand this, but a large percentage of people have sought out eq, and continue to play eq, because content is not instanced. This is a MMO, not a co-op.

There are 17 raid worthy mobs in Kunark, and an abundance of guilds capable of killing them. In your ideal raid world, the guilds on this server would be incentived into breaking into several different pieces to (1) kill things with the smallest force possible (maximum fun in your mind), and (2) maintain some semblance of efficiency.

The resulting rotation would be a raid calendar filled with 10-15 guilds, averaging basically one kill per week, 5 or so kills per month. This is hardly compelling. I understand that its compelling to you, because apparently all you want is a thrill every now and then and you're happy. I wonder if after a month of that you would still find it compelling.

TMO/IB/FE and some other guilds who actually want to raid and compete (albiet in a respectful way) represent a large portion of this servers population. Lets not throw the baby out with the bathwater, to borrow a phrase from BMQ.


Dolic

[Ungriim]

Originally Posted by Fael [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Ugrim. I know you cannot understand this, but a large percentage of people have sought out eq, and continue to play eq, because content is not instanced. This is a MMO, not a co-op.

.....

The resulting rotation would be a raid calendar filled with 10-15 guilds, averaging basically one kill per week, 5 or so kills per month.....

Dolic

Dolic - I understand that you either do not know how to read or have no ability to comprehend meta or abstract thought.

I'm not saying to take down the raid scene. In fact my plan would have it be the same 90% of the time. I never said shit about any type of forced rotation. I said that the 2 hour rule implies a rotation until a 3rd guild gets established to challenge. I also said that my idea would imply that for top tier guilds - 4/4 weeks would be FTE on VP and 3/4 weeks would be FTE on old content, while for lower guilds it would be 4/4 weeks FTE in VP, 3/4 weeks it would be FTE on old content, and 1/4 weeks it would be FTE circa 2010/2011 p99 raid scene.

[Splorf22]

Dolic, you keep using this word 'competition', and I'm not sure you know what it means. How do you plan to be better than the other guy?

For example: a basketball player can be taller, or faster, or have better reflexes, or have a better three point shot. A quake player can have better reflexes or practice more than his opponents. A chess player can calculate better or learn more openings. An EQ player in 2001 could outlevel or out AA his competitors, and come up with new strategies.

None of this applies on P1999. Everyone uses the same simple strategies - especially for raiding, which is basically 'put on MR gear and faceroll your keyboard for 30 seconds'. The game is slow as molasses, so reflexes don't apply. We have Vent to coordinate easily, and the game mechanics don't prevent people from showing up with three times the number of people the designers intended.

So 'competition' on this server is defined purely in terms of time spent. Time spent tracking, time spent leveling and gearing your alt army so you can camp out (and don't care if one of them is banned for training), time spent batphoning in the middle of the night. And all of these are artifacts of variance. None of them would matter with true classic mechanics. People keep saying 'Oh, in classic the uberguilds got everything'. Yes, but that was because a) Verant moved the content treadmill very fast and b) they actually had to figure stuff out. None of that applies here.

Therefore, when you say 'TMO and other guilds actually want to raid and compete' what you are really saying is 'My dopamine levels are dependent on non-classic mechanics which allow me to kill pixel dragons because I spend more time facerolling my keyboard than the other players'.

[Fael]

Originally Posted by Splorf22 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Dolic, you keep using this word 'competition', and I'm not sure you know what it means. How do you plan to be better than the other guy?

Loraen, your initial response questions my understanding of the word competition, but then you digress into talking about the concept of "being better than the other guy,"fast reflexes, etc. Ironically, that really has nothing to do with the word competition, which is simply "the act or process of trying to get or win something (such as a prize or a higher level of success) that someone else is also trying to get or win."

That said, i trust that you actually do know what the word competition means. And I imagine that supremacy can in fact read and write (i for one can do it better than 95% of people who took the LSAT three years ago, which admittedly doesn't mean much).

There are aspects of raiding now that I absolutely find compelling. I for one enjoy kiting fear while other guilds are also trying to go for the engage. I enjoy finding and pulling dragons before the other guild gets fte, etc, etc. I enjoy rushing to form up groups, get final buffs, and engage trakanon or others mob as quickly as possible before the other guild does, or if the other guild engages too early and fails, etc. All of that requires decisions to be made, coordination, luck, the possibility of failure, etc, which makes raiding compelling to me.

I admit, my dopamine levels are dependent on the fact that not every encounter is like Noble, where several guilds spam auto attack and murder the mob in masse. You of course may want it to be that bad, in hopes that the sheer retardedness would force a rotation.

I question whether or not that would actually force a rotation, particularly when velious is supposedly 3 months out, and considering that most velious mobs are on a variance anyways.


Dolic

[radditsu]

My wife gave me a handjob and I fell asleep. Did anyone want me to put a proposal to my non weighted monthly point system?

I see alot of circle jerking since I fell asleep

[Fael]

I'm not sure running down democrats, representing roughly half the population of the server (and 100% of casual scum if your theory is correct) is the best way of winning some hearts and minds.

Just sayin!

Dolic

[Ungriim]

I find it mind-blowing at this point that after 2+years of Kunark there are still so many pixel-hungry idiots that actually WANT to grow neckbeards and buttonmash targets for 72 hours. Go play a fucking FPS and chill out

I'm also upset that so far most of FE leadership seems to be posting that they will not be giving up targets to "casuals" in a raid scene that has spiraled out of comprehension.

[Alarti0001]

Originally Posted by Ungriim [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I find it mind-blowing at this point that after 2+years of Kunark there are still so many pixel-hungry idiots that actually WANT to grow neckbeards and buttonmash targets for 72 hours. Go play a fucking FPS and chill out

I'm also upset that so far most of FE leadership seems to be posting that they will not be giving up targets to "casuals" in a raid scene that has spiraled out of comprehension.

Lol you actually believed their past rhetoric?

[Ungriim]

^ exactly what this guy said