And now we're terrorists..

[Hailto]

And?

What i said before still stands, refusing to work, and barring commerce like the idiots you see in the video standing in front of trains are two different things.

[Hasbinbad]

So what do you suggest we do in order to change the situation, Hailto?

[Hailto]

If you want to protest, that's fine. If you want to go on strike, that's fine. First amendment rights are extremely important in this country, but it goes both ways, when you start encroaching on other people's rights is when you cross the line. The video i linked earlier in this thread is a good example of things that give your movement a bad name, stand out there and picket until you're blue in the face if you want, but stay off the train tracks and let the guy who actually trying to make some money do his damn job.

[Hasbinbad]

Originally Posted by Hailto [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If you want to protest, that's fine. If you want to go on strike, that's fine. First amendment rights are extremely important in this country, but it goes both ways, when you start encroaching on other people's rights is when you cross the line. The video i linked earlier in this thread is a good example of things that give your movement a bad name, stand out there and picket until you're blue in the face if you want, but stay off the train tracks and let the guy who actually trying to make some money do his damn job.

So what you're suggesting is that we stand there like idiots with signs while people with power ignore us?

That is what hasn't worked since bloody thursday.

Nothing has ever been changed by people with signs. All major civil rights movements have had an element of struggle attached to them that made the people impossible to ignore. With women, men not getting laid by their wives nipped that shit in the bud quick. With Racism, it took an old black woman breaking the law on a bus to kick start the whole deal, and then several major black leaders went to jail and were killed before any real progress was made. The gay rights movement has probably had the easiest time as far as protests go, but they have a hundred years of straight up hate crimes to put wind in their sails. Nothing changed the Vietnam war until the people in power decided it was to end, because the hippies were - by and large - not willing to go to phase 2, and were distracted by drugs.

What can we do in this world that will force them to stop economically raping us besides what we are doing? Standing there with a sign isn't doing it bro. We're open to suggestions.

Also, it is hardly equitable to ask us to keep strictly within the bounds of the law, when those laws are corrupt in the first place, and they do things like vote in the senate for the ability to suspend habeus corpus in this country at will. When they do things like unleash less lethal weapons on peaceful protestors. When they do things like enforce illegal foreclosures on the working poor and the middle class. When they do things like send big dumb jocks in official uniforms to club legally and peacefully protesting tiny female UC Berkeley students in the gut at full force when there were at least ten other tactical options to achieve the same effect in a non-violent way. When the police break the law, what are we supposed to do?

This is not Oceania. You don't belong to the Inner Party. This is not double plus good.

[Humerox]

Maybe we're not all on the same page.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/b0BiADVGp6s" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[Hasbinbad]

..anyway, the port closure is what is known as civil disobedience. We're doing it because it is both civil (peaceful [no violence]) and disobedient (probably breaking the law, and certainly not what they want us to do). Some pretty smart people have encouraged us to be civilly disobedient throughout human history.

[visage]

Originally Posted by Hasbinbad [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So what you're suggesting is that we stand there like idiots with signs while people with power ignore us?

That is what hasn't worked since bloody thursday.

Nothing has ever been changed by people with signs. All major civil rights movements have had an element of struggle attached to them that made the people impossible to ignore. With women, men not getting laid by their wives nipped that shit in the bud quick. With Racism, it took an old black woman breaking the law on a bus to kick start the whole deal, and then several major black leaders went to jail and were killed before any real progress was made. The gay rights movement has probably had the easiest time as far as protests go, but they have a hundred years of straight up hate crimes to put wind in their sails. Nothing changed the Vietnam war until the people in power decided it was to end, because the hippies were - by and large - not willing to go to phase 2, and were distracted by drugs.

What can we do in this world that will force them to stop economically raping us besides what we are doing? Standing there with a sign isn't doing it bro. We're open to suggestions.

Also, it is hardly equitable to ask us to keep strictly within the bounds of the law, when those laws are corrupt in the first place, and they do things like vote in the senate for the ability to suspend habeus corpus in this country at will. When they do things like unleash less lethal weapons on peaceful protestors. When they do things like enforce illegal foreclosures on the working poor and the middle class. When they do things like send big dumb jocks in official uniforms to club legally and peacefully protesting tiny female UC Berkeley students in the gut at full force when there were at least ten other tactical options to achieve the same effect in a non-violent way. When the police break the law, what are we supposed to do?

This is not Oceania. You don't belong to the Inner Party. This is not double plus good.

Heres a sign that changed , and had things change. I figured it was something you yourself help change
[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Hasbinbad]

visage This message is hidden because visage is on your ignore list.

[Hasbinbad]

Originally Posted by Humerox [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Maybe we're not all on the same page.

Those look like people who were 10ish in 1969, completely missed out on the hippie movement, and still think that working within the system can create real change. Optimists. Real (old [60+ years old now]) hippies understand Occupy, and why the ideas in that video simply will not work. There is a reason you haven't heard more from them since October 17th.

[Humerox]

The only way to work outside the system is to start talking armed revolution, which isn't going to happen.

Look what happened in the Arab Spring. Change CAN occur and social media can be the catalyst. Change can occur if enough people start speaking out.