Solo Barbarian Shaman Stat Allocation - Page 4

ArbiterBlixen · #1 07-20-2022, 10:48 PM

Whoops, i forgot othmir prexus totem, i was originally building it with some of loramin’s items in mind as well. But sounds like that’s in your price range anyway.

ArbiterBlixen · #2 07-21-2022, 12:15 PM

It's objectively true that it's harder to get 300 mana worth of gear than 75hp.

If OP is a smart person that wants balance among their valued stats, choosing wisdom as a starting stat covers far more ground in that pursuit than stamina does.

loramin · #3 07-21-2022, 12:35 PM

It's not about how much you type, it's about engaging in a conversation and not just trying to win imaginary battles in your head.

As for the rest, you're still dodging my points, but at least you're trying to engage now which is a nice improvement. So let's focus on my points. 1) If it's nearly impossible for a non-raid Shaman to max Stamina (without doing a completely unrealistic all-Stamina-focused build AND that build being completely realized ... ie. the Shaman is at the end of their career) ... then it doesn't matter which stat is easier to cap.

2) If you aren't hitting the cap, then it truly comes down to which is more valuable, mana or HP ... and HP is more valuable. When "You got bad luck" (as you put it), you don't want to die: more HP helps increase the chances that you don't, while mana simply doesn't.

DeathsSilkyMist · #4 07-21-2022, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It's not about how much you type, it's about engaging in a conversation and not just trying to win imaginary battles in your head.

As for the rest, you're still dodging my points, but at least you're trying to engage now which is a nice improvement. So let's focus on my points. 1) If it's nearly impossible for a non-raid Shaman to max Stamina (without doing a completely unrealistic all-Stamina-focused build AND that build being completely realized ... ie. the Shaman is at the end of their career) ... then it doesn't matter which stat is easier to cap.

2) If you aren't hitting the cap, then it truly comes down to which is more valuable, mana or HP ... and HP is more valuable. When "You got bad luck" (as you put it), you don't want to die: more HP helps increase the chances that you don't, while mana simply doesn't.

I am engaging in the conversation, and I am not dodging any points. Your "imaginary battle" fantasy is just silly and wrong. Please stop wasting time on it. Making up random and wrong assumptions about other people doesn't help your argument.

1. Wrong, it is not nearly impossible. Two different Magelos made by two different people with two different gear selections show this. Both Magelos do not have unobtainable raid gear for a non-raid Shaman. Every item in both of those Magelos could be obtained without raiding.

2. We are discussing 75HP vs 150-250ish Mana at level 60. Neither of those are very valuable by themselves. If 150 mana or 75HP determined the outcome of the battle, the problem wasn't your starting stats. Mana DOES increase your chances of not dying too. I have run out of Mana before due to bad resist chains. Shaman spells are expensive. That is dangerous because you may not have enough mana to gate, and not enough HP to cannibalize safely. Having an extra 200 mana means you could land 1 more slow, root, torpor, or gate. That CAN save your life.

ArbiterBlixen · #5 07-21-2022, 12:52 PM

https://wiki.project1999.com/Magelo_Blue:Barbsham2

Here you go Loramin an easily attained wis starting stat build that maxes stamina. Wis still not close to max. No items here require raiding.

Edit, the page is going in and out of working, not sure why

loramin · #6 07-21-2022, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I am engaging in the conversation, and I am not dodging any points. Your "imaginary battle" fantasy is just silly and wrong. Please stop wasting time on it.

1. Wrong, it is not nearly impossible. Two different Magelos made by two different people with two different gear selections show this. Both Magelos do not have unobtainable raid gear for a non-raid Shaman. Every item in both of those Magelos could be obtained without raiding.

Again, you really need to read the threads you participate in: up until this post there was exactly one Magelo ... the guy just renamed it because Danth was like "why are you calling it Danth's Wife?", and you didn't read the actual thread, so you thought there were two.

But, (right after you wrote that), there actually were two ...

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArbiterBlixen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

https://wiki.project1999.com/Magelo_Blue:Barbsham2

Here you go Loramin an easily attained wis starting stat build that maxes stamina. Wis still not close to max. No items here require raiding.

So look, I appreciate that you're actually doing the work to prove your point, and you've clearly proved that:

A) if you want Stamina, there are "better" ways to gear a Shaman than the way Loramin is geared (... if you like having a lot less AC, no regen, no instant-clicky item, ...)

B) it is possible, with more than just one possible build, to cap max Stamina as a casual Shaman

But none of that disputes my original point, and in fact your Magelos really just support it, because: they're end-game Shaman. They're not 0-60 Shaman, they're not 60-Torpor Shaman, and they're not Torpor-"final gear (or nearly)" Shaman ... they're just "final gear (or nearly) Shaman".

For the vast, vast majority of OP's playtime, everything until they have all but the very last few item slots filled with the very best items they can possibly acquire ... they will not hit the cap.

DeathsSilkyMist · #7 07-21-2022, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Again, you really need to read the threads you participate in: up until this post there was exactly one Magelo ... the guy just renamed it because Danth was like "why are you calling it Danth's Wife?", and you didn't read the actual thread, so you thought there were two.

But, (right after you wrote that), there actually were two ...

So look, I appreciate that you're actually doing the work to prove your point, and you've clearly proved that:

A) if you want Stamina, there are "better" ways to gear a Shaman than the way Loramin is geared (... if you like having a lot less AC, no regen, no instant-clicky item, ...)

B) it is possible, with more than just one possible build, to cap max Stamina as a casual Shaman

But none of that disputes my original point, and in fact your Magelos really just support it, because: they're end-game Shaman. They're not 0-60 Shaman, they're not 60-Torpor Shaman, and they're not Torpor-"final gear (or nearly)" Shaman ... they're just "final gear (or nearly) Shaman".

For the vast, vast majority of OP's playtime, everything until they have all but the very last few item slots filled with the very best items they can possibly acquire ... they will not hit the cap.

I did read the thread, you need to take your own advice lol.

https://wiki.project1999.com/Magelo_Blue:BarbShaman was posted by Siberious, and https://wiki.project1999.com/Magelo_Blue[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]anthswife was posted by Arbiterblixen. So yes, there were two different people with two different Magelos[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I am not sure why you are talking about 0-60 Shaman, since you yourself said you are not talking about them.

I was capped on STA before I got Torpor or level 60, and that was all funded by basically just killing guards lol. People can easily cap STA if they put some effort into it. If someone is truly so casual that they have garbage gear at level 60, they probably don't care about their starting stats either to be honest. If they cared about stats, they would progress their gear.

Finally, you are dodging my point about Mana being able to save your life too, since you seem to have this weird idea that it cant.

Danth · #8 07-21-2022, 02:40 PM

Comparison of lower-end characters continued:

I logged the wife's character on earlier rather than going from memory and her character's unbuffed stats were higher than I recalled; at 175 stamina she can max it out any time she wants simply by using an alchemy potion and switching out her goblin earring. In practice she doesn't bother because it doesn't matter in a duo, but that reduces my earlier comment of "never has maxed it" to technically correct, but effectively wrong insofar as this specific conversation is concerned. Her character was at 1950 HP, 2289 mana, 903 AC unbuffed. 175 stamina, 230-something WIS.

Note again we mostly duo so the mediocre AC is acceptable for her (who needs AC if you aren't getting hit?) but I would recommend more for a dedicated solo'er. On the occasions I log on her character and use it to solo something she does get smacked harder than I'd prefer.

BP/arms/legs are Thurgadin. Only problematic items for a current non-raider would be the epic and the FD ring. She got the epic in 2012 when it was virtually automatic and the FD ring was a (much appreciated) gift from a friend of ours. If I wanted to set it up more for solo'ing about 25-30 more stamina and ~100 display AC would be nice at the cost of trading some of that mana pool away. She was at 105 stamina/wis default. If you took the same character with a stamina focus you'd be at 195 stamina base, still over 3K mana, and have room to up that AC rating a bit for a more solo-oriented focus. Optionally you vcould make the same change entirely with gearing, highlighting that 20 points of a statistic are not a lot either way in this game, and that starting statistics and equipment choice very much inter-mingles.

Danth

Jimjam · #9 07-21-2022, 01:16 PM

The real answer is all strength. At 60 the benefit provided by a couple dozen of any stat is a blip. That aspect has already been discussed. At low/mid levels the same strength is worth +100pp every single time you vendor (a bunch of fine steel / bronze / armour each vendor visit) and it has a noticeable impact on your melee (which is relevant till 40).

You’re gonna vendor more than a thousand times on the way to 60 ergo going max strength is the equivalent of starting with torpor (a 100,000 pp spell).

Move to resolved.

DeathsSilkyMist · #10 07-21-2022, 02:08 PM

The only person who isn't reading the thread is you Loramin lol. I explained multiple times how mana can save your life as a Shaman. Please READ THE THREAD, I will not be rehashing it just because you are projecting your lack of reading on to me[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

And again:

https://wiki.project1999.com/Magelo_Blue:BarbShaman was created by Siberious:

Quote:

02:50, 21 July 2022‎ Siberious (Talk | contribs)‎ . . (1,038 bytes) (+1,038)‎ . . (Created page with "startMageloProfile * Name: BarbShaman * Class: Shaman * Race: Barbarian * Level: 60 * Guild: * Religion: * AltOrTestChar: No * BaseSTR: 103 * BaseSTA: 105 * BaseAGI: 82 * ...")

https://wiki.project1999.com/Magelo_Blue:Bobo (previously https://wiki.project1999.com/Magelo_Blueanthswife ) was created by Arbiterblixen:

Quote:

03:10, 21 July 2022 Arbiterblixen (Talk | contribs) moved page Magelo Blue[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]anthswife to Magelo Blue:Bobo (revert)

Quote:

03:10, 21 July 2022‎ Arbiterblixen (Talk | contribs)‎ m . . (1,044 bytes) (0)‎ . . (Arbiterblixen moved page Magelo Blue[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]anthswife to Magelo Blue:Bobo) (undo)

Siberious posted his magelo on page 7, and Arbiterblixen posted his magelo on page 6. Both of those pages were before my post on page 8. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]