Is a "No Lock-Down" Rule Possible?

[Illsiff]

Start a publicly visible list:

1) Create a Discord server.
2) Name it p99 poopsocking.
3) List all the poopsocking camps as channels. (These are easily searchable with ctrl + k.)
4) Make it publicly accessible to anyone who joins.
5) Create a few rules for etiquette, but keep it simple
6) Pray for cooperation
7) Pixelquest

I don't see it really working any other way.

[Evia]

Originally Posted by Illsiff [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Start a publicly visible list:

1) Create a Discord server.
2) Name it p99 poopsocking.
3) List all the poopsocking camps as channels. (These are easily searchable with ctrl + k.)
4) Make it publicly accessible to anyone who joins.
5) Create a few rules for etiquette, but keep it simple
6) Pray for cooperation
7) Pixelquest

I don't see it really working any other way.

I like this idea.

[Mead]

Originally Posted by Triiz [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I get the idea, but I don't see how it could realistically be implemented without a GM at X item camp 24 hours a day 7 days a week which obviously wont happen.

Maybe I'm just pessimistic, but from a casual standpoint I imagine camping a Manastone on a new server to be a pipe dream for 95% of the server. People always talk about how bad camping AC is 7+ years into the server, I imagine Manastone/Guise would be that multiplied by at least 100.

I mostly play EST mornings, I never really get to play during the server "prime time", there is usually ~500 people on when I log in but it wouldn't even take 100 people to keep every valuable classic item perma-camped.

If you don't play p99 80+ hours a week you are at a huge disadvantage, that's just the reality of classic eq. Poopsockers gonna poop sock.

If anything you're realistic.

Originally Posted by Lhancelot [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I finally get to write it first!!!! Sorry Loramin...

THAT'S NOT CLASSIC!

Honestly though, I see no way they could enforce such a rule. They already have guide time monopolized by trying to monitor raids, how could they even begin to start trying to watch specific camps in the game?

All this would do is create constant petitions for every camp on the server. They would have petitions sent in complaining about that loser lvl 50 necro that farms orc1 and orc2 daily every morning for 4 hours, etc.

The petitions would never end.

Originally Posted by Kesselring [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If green ever happens, there should be lines for certain camps. Youre next in line when the person(s) leave, you get the camp. Not their friends. This should be the same with everything. If you're physically at Ancient Cyclops camp waiting in line and nobody else is... you're next in line period. Not some arbitrary list. Nobody in a sane mind would argue with this logic. People are putting in time to WAIT for something they should have the next go at it. When the GM's go to look at who was there longer in zone, that's all that should matter during camp disputes. You don't get to pass off camps to people you want if there's people actively waiting right there. That's how it was on live, hell we had a line for scout back in the day too. There was a literal calendar full of player names on our servers forums for scout. Yes that isn't sitting there physically but we all agreed that waiting 10 hours per spawn physically was a bit much.

It's simple, nobody waiting in line for your camp? You give it to whomever the fuck you want.

One of the biggest issues with this type of rule implementation is the stress placed on the GMs. They're already stretched thin with the raid scene and the million rules that require a p99 licensed attorney. The last thing you want to do is add more rules to this place when they're having a hard enough time enforcing or probably even understanding the current rules themselves.

Unfortunately, obtaining things like manastone, guise, and fungi staff has rarely been attainable for the casual player. That's part of what makes this game the way it is. Be prepared for that to not change.

[Lhancelot]

Originally Posted by Mead [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Unfortunately, obtaining things like manastone, guise, and fungi staff has rarely been attainable for the casual player. That's part of what makes this game the way it is. Be prepared for that to not change.

Yep.

[loramin]

Originally Posted by Mead [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Unfortunately, obtaining things like manastone, guise, and fungi staff has rarely been attainable for the casual player. That's part of what makes this game the way it is. Be prepared for that to not change.

I guess it depends on when you're talking about and what you mean by casual. Arguably everyone in classic was "casual": nobody was pooping in socks in '99. Also no one knew these items would get nerfed ... but that cat's out of the bag now, and there's no way to put it back in.

Still even with everyone knowing about these items now, there's a big difference between "you literally cannot get this item unless (maybe) you log in at 4AM several nights in a row" vs. "it will take you hours and hours of waiting in line to even get the camp, and then you've got the RNG to deal with once you do". Even the latter will prevent 90% of the player base from ever getting such an item, but when someone locks the camp down it means 99.9% of the server won't get to camp the item. I don't believe that is in any way classic or an unavoidable part of the game.

Originally Posted by Mead [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

One of the biggest issues with this type of rule implementation is the stress placed on the GMs. They're already stretched thin with the raid scene and the million rules that require a p99 licensed attorney. The last thing you want to do is add more rules to this place when they're having a hard enough time enforcing or probably even understanding the current rules themselves.

Amen. As I said, even if lockdowns would have been prevented on live (and again, read that GM manual and I think you'll agree they probably would have), we're not on live and we don't have a paid GM staff. So if we're going to prevent lockdowns here it has to work for the staff.

So far the simplest, least staff effort idea that I've heard amounts to "new rule: you can only pass a camp off to the next person who has been waiting in line, in zone." Staff already have to deal with fights over camps today, and I would imagine they have a way to find out how long someone has been in a zone, so I don't think this rule would add a huge amount of work for them, Maybe when it first gets added, but pretty soon everyone would learn that if you don't pass the camp properly you get petitioned, and once people learn that I think the staff would have no more fights over camps than they already do.

[Maner]

Even the elder bead line wasn't something the guides enforced and it was ignored multiple times by people locking the camp down within their own guilds.

[Maner]

Originally Posted by Swish [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

That queue lol, reminds me of this >> [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

i remember getting on the list friday night and having my turn come up on monday

[Kesselring]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I guess it depends on when you're talking about and what you mean by casual. Arguably everyone in classic was "casual": nobody was pooping in socks in '99. Also no one knew these items would get nerfed ... but that cat's out of the bag now, and there's no way to put it back in.

Still even with everyone knowing about these items now, there's a big difference between "you literally cannot get this item unless (maybe) you log in at 4AM several nights in a row" vs. "it will take you hours and hours of waiting in line to even get the camp, and then you've got the RNG to deal with once you do". Even the latter will prevent 90% of the player base from ever getting such an item, but when someone locks the camp down it means 99.9% of the server won't get to camp the item. I don't believe that is in any way classic or an unavoidable part of the game.



Amen. As I said, even if lockdowns would have been prevented on live (and again, read that GM manual and I think you'll agree they probably would have), we're not on live and we don't have a paid GM staff. So if we're going to prevent lockdowns here it has to work for the staff.

So far the simplest, least staff effort idea that I've heard amounts to "new rule: you can only pass a camp off to the next person who has been waiting in line, in zone." Staff already have to deal with fights over camps today, and I would imagine they have a way to find out how long someone has been in a zone, so I don't think this rule would add a huge amount of work for them, Maybe when it first gets added, but pretty soon everyone would learn that if you don't pass the camp properly you get petitioned, and once people learn that I think the staff would have no more fights over camps than they already do.

Exactly that, GM's can see how long someone has been in zone. It's pretty easy to wait in line and pretty simple rule to follow. It's even more hardcore playstyle to physically wait in line for a camp. Nowhere would the rules imply passing a camp off to a friend is how it works. In fact I've been on frenzy in velks multiple times where this is exactly the case. Someone waits at the camp wanting to get it next, someone else tries to tell their friend to come take it from them and the ive seen the guy waiting in line win the GM's favor in a petition (at least so they told me, which i can't exactly confirm, but it makes sense).

[Lhancelot]

Originally Posted by Kesselring [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Exactly that, GM's can see how long someone has been in zone. It's pretty easy to wait in line and pretty simple rule to follow. It's even more hardcore playstyle to physically wait in line for a camp. Nowhere would the rules imply passing a camp off to a friend is how it works. In fact I've been on frenzy in velks multiple times where this is exactly the case. Someone waits at the camp wanting to get it next, someone else tries to tell their friend to come take it from them and the ive seen the guy waiting in line win the GM's favor in a petition (at least so they told me, which i can't exactly confirm, but it makes sense).

This is all bull crap. ^^^

It's been explained by admin that the person holding the camp CAN pass it to whoever they want.

Player made lists are only honored because the player holding the camp chooses to do so.

[Triiz]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I guess it depends on when you're talking about and what you mean by casual. Arguably everyone in classic was "casual": nobody was pooping in socks in '99.

My entire time on live was on Veeshan, and Fires of Heaven made some of the neckbeards on this server look like employed, productive citizens. I quit around the time Velious came out, but those guys made EQ their life from 1999-2001. A year or so ago I read an old Reddit post that was a story from Furor recalling how during Kunark he helped a guild do a CR in one of the Planes with his 20 personal Staves of Forbidden Rites. Those guys were not "casual" in any sense of the word.


Casuals may have been the majority, but poopsockers have always been a part of EQ.