Programming - Advice?

[dafier]

Last thing I'll say is I personally like programming because in the career field you are inventing everything. Of course you face time lines and what not, but YOU are the creator. There is no SOP (standard operating procedures) to guide you through a boring process in which a monkey can do.

Most the time when you are given a project, your mind is your limit. MIS, in which I work right now, and have been for the last 20 years is freaking boring as shit. It's the same crap over and over.

edit:

The only thing that keeps you on your toes in MIS is security. How to make things more secure.....it's a constant struggle.

[mgellan]

Originally Posted by Cave Troll [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

pick 1 thing get a cert and get an entry level job immediately

Wow, dunno where you are, but I give entry level jobs to University or Community College grads, not guys with one cert under their belt... I've worked in industry as well as government, it's the same. No shortcuts, get at least a 2 year Community College certificate so you know more than one thing badly.

Regards,
Mg

[Naethyn]

Originally Posted by mgellan [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Wow, dunno where you are, but I give entry level jobs to University or Community College grads, not guys with one cert under their belt... I've worked in industry as well as government, it's the same. No shortcuts, get at least a 2 year Community College certificate so you know more than one thing badly.

Regards,
Mg

This is a very interesting perspective. I've found that most places hiring programmers are deathly afraid of a fresh college grad with zero experience. Almost always someone who has certs or actual experience is preferred. Obviously this is exempt from work programs offered through colleges, but that is usually cheap unit test labor.

Unless of course you are talking about working for the government. A great opportunity for a new programmer, but a huge pay cut after you've reached your 2 and 5 year mark compared to the market of a big city.

Oh ya, make sure to record the date that you get payed to be a programmer. A clock starts ticking. After 2 years you're worth double and at 5 it doubles again.

[paulgiamatti]

There is no one-size-fits-all path to success in any industry, but IT is one of the few industries where pursuing a 2/4-year degree will actually pay off, even if it's not completely necessary. It will get your foot in the door, and it will embellish your resume making you much more likely to land an actually good salaried position at a reputable company. Personally, I'd rather take less pay and have less job security at a company that's just starting out and trying something new and innovative than join the ranks of an established business. There are just tons of factors that play into it and each person's ideal scenario is going to differ.

[paulgiamatti]

It will pay off if you aren't incompetent like the person you've described. And no, in IT degrees are not worthless, and they will still make you more marketable and more desirable to companies who don't require degrees.

[shatterblast]

Originally Posted by Angushjalmur [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

make a dinky rpg and look up how to do shit as you go

experience is better than studying

Seriously though, looking stuff up is studying. It's more than memorizing whatever for some test. It's about knowledge, understanding, and maybe even "wisdom" if you go that far into it.

[mickmoranis]

Originally Posted by shatterblast [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Seriously though, looking stuff up is studying. It's more than memorizing whatever for some test. It's about knowledge, understanding, and maybe even "wisdom" if you go that far into it.

thats true but you'll never fucking know why you see <iostream> or why you're using a double long instead of a float without someone to ask questions to in a class.

I definitely think that being around other programmers for at least 1 semester > reading/doing 10,000 books and tutorials.

programming, even if you can do it, can be a very inefficient way of doing everything if you dont know why youre doing anything.

[maskedmelon]

Originally Posted by mickmoranis [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

thats true but you'll never fucking know why you see <iostream> or why you're using a double long instead of a float without someone to ask questions to in a class.

I definitely think that being around other programmers for at least 1 semester > reading/doing 10,000 books and tutorials.

programming, even if you can do it, can be a very inefficient way of doing everything if you dont know why youre doing anything.

I understand where you are coming from with this. I honestly think a lot more professions should involve apprenticeships. There is SO much to be learned simply from watching someone else's work flow. I've learned more in 10 minutes of watching someone work than I have from several books (other fields).