VGOEmulator Updates

[xinux]

P.S. I think I know who OP is, and OP is a very mad sad bad person. Just sayin. Not a secret or anything.

I'm not sure what i said to give you that impression that i'm a very mad sad bad person and as far as i know no one think's i'm a bad person. Now as for who i am I've always gone by either Xinux or Xinu on EQEMU and most every other forum I've ever been on.

[maerilith]

I said think, meaning speculation, thanks for clarifying, if you are just Xinux (play on *nix* I assume) kewl.

Plz understand I don't rly believe about anything about anyone and am fairly skeptical tho.

U should be 2 <3 (sorry, you can be whatever u want bae)

[R Flair]

Originally Posted by maerilith [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think if vanguard had a few million $$ in budget it would have beaten out wow.

But then it would have sucked as bad as wow because the devs wuld just have blown it all on hookers, blow, and sex changes.

No one in their right mind was going to ever trust Vanguards creator with 10s of millions tho... he probably would have gotten the doe though if he had pitched vanguard and his name/brand to a big executive player and sold out so that nameless exec could have soaked in the cash investment in the next big wow. Sony wouldn't let him do that though (and the sony execs sure as hell didn't trust him after dealing face2face) hence his little garage shop business venture. And he wasn't smart or wise enough to do that and cash out his nest egg + nice investment in a dev he could bend to his will for his "dream game".

50 shades of rainbow colord pixels.

P.S. I think I know who OP is, and OP is a very mad sad bad person. Just sayin. Not a secret or anything.

Also moar P.S. strong smart brilliant business women looking for rich sugardaddy to play with. We can world dominate together, namean [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

wtf is this^ incoherent dribble?

You have your facts and timeline completely backwards.

McQuaid had nothing but respect before the end of Vanguard. He had over 30 million from M$ before they pulled his funding after a regime change.

He was behind deadline and lost his funding, he did sell out with his rep alone to exec/pal smed @ SOE.

It sounds like you are confusing Vanguard with Pantheon.

[JayDee]

I think you got something here. Me and my circle of friends are definitely in.

[Bisonzabi]

Originally Posted by R Flair [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

wtf is this^ incoherent dribble?

You have your facts and timeline completely backwards.

McQuaid had nothing but respect before the end of Vanguard. He had over 30 million from M$ before they pulled his funding after a regime change.

He was behind deadline and lost his funding, he did sell out with his rep alone to exec/pal smed @ SOE.

It sounds like you are confusing Vanguard with Pantheon.

It was both regime change and the games current state that really turned them off. Plus Brad being a drug addict at the time (how many years?) didn't help.

"It could have beaten WoW if..." is the old tired line used by every single person out there for any upcoming MMO. I remember it was AoC, Warhammer, LOTRO, ESO, ect ect. Well established franchises and yet they never held a candle, Vanguard being made by a new studio and had almost no marketing didn't help with that. The bitterness of WoW is crazy, it's been almost 12 years since that game came out and had they thrown a couple more millions at the Vanguards development it wouldn't have made a difference. The entire structure of the development team was a mess and countless developers that were part of Sigil went on long rants of just how awful it was 9-8 years ago.

And regarding SoE, he had no choice. It was either that, or the game wouldn't ever come out and the studio would have closed sooner.

[maerilith]

You guyz have valid points. I don't have all the facts. I just know a bit of the drama that went down.

A lot of that wouldn't have happened if McQuaid "ownered" (executively produced) instead of being on crack in everyones assholes.

He wasted money playing god... also were talking 30$ millions vs 100's of millions.

That's a BIG difference for a business. A lot of vanguard was simply unfinished.

He scared people away with his crazy. (Sorry Mcquaid) Reall it's nothing personal. My brother is the exact same way but on a slightly smaller scale so maybe I'm projecting and speculating some. I do think McQuaid is a brilliant guy, though it may be a bit late for him in such a stressful industry. If I was a doctor I'd tell him to relax and work on his internal issues that stopped him from being successful now b4 he's 60 yrs old and way beyond the red line.

He could be successful and happy at 50, vs dead and going thru DTs in some hospital bed if he got his shit together appropriately.

P.S. vanguard was a great game, part of that was McQuaid, it just wasn't pulled together, didn't have the business to support it after launch with sales, advertisement, and support, and mostly 99%ly damage control.

I appreciate both your feedbacks. Not writing off, you guys are very rights.

[R Flair]

Originally Posted by Bisonzabi [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It was both regime change and the games current state that really turned them off. Plus Brad being a drug addict at the time (how many years?) didn't help.

"It could have beaten WoW if..." is the old tired line used by every single person out there for any upcoming MMO. I remember it was AoC, Warhammer, LOTRO, ESO, ect ect. Well established franchises and yet they never held a candle, Vanguard being made by a new studio and had almost no marketing didn't help with that. The bitterness of WoW is crazy, it's been almost 12 years since that game came out and had they thrown a couple more millions at the Vanguards development it wouldn't have made a difference. The entire structure of the development team was a mess and countless developers that were part of Sigil went on long rants of just how awful it was 9-8 years ago.

And regarding SoE, he had no choice. It was either that, or the game wouldn't ever come out and the studio would have closed sooner.

All very true, though I never claimed, nor did I ever hear anyone else claim, that Vanguard "could have beaten WoW." It sure as shit could have done a hell of a lot better if they had another year worth of funding to finish the game though. Even in an unfinished state it had so much about it that was just unparalleled in any other mmo.

[AzzarTheGod]

shout out to vanguard for backin out on behalf of my shooter

[AenorVZ]

Thanks for all the updates xinux! I'm going to load this up at some point and take it for a spin.

[AenorVZ]

For those of you sounding off about Vanguard's failure to live up to its hype as the real successor to EQ, here's the history as I recall it from various sources.

1. Brad led up the development of EQ with an approximately $8 million initial budget. They performed miracles with that budget.

2. WoW was developed as a dumbed-down version of EQ with instancing so that all content was available to all players, removing the bottle necks of EQ that created class stratification of haves and have nots. WoW's budget approached $100 million and much of that was spent on graphics optimizations that allowed the game to run on very old systems, making the game accessible to something like the broadest possible audience.

3. Microsoft invested something close to $30 million in Vanguard. Developers who put Brad on blast after the mass firing said he was an absentee developer who was making public statements about pie-in-the-sky functionality like ship to ship warfare while Microsoft was preparing to fold the development because Sigil hadn't proven they could deliver a finished product.

4. The work on the game that was accomplished once Sony bought the IP from Microsoft for pennies on the dollar was described as miraculous. The people who actively worked on the game were credited with pulling a rabbit out of the hat to get the game to the point that we experienced in beta and launch. Vanguard delivered as a game with high system requirements that didn't look good enough to justify them and had hitching even on high end systems.

McQuaid later said he had an "understanding" with Microsoft that Vanguard would be funded as a AAA title and that they pulled funding and didn't fulfill their end. Firstly, it's absurd to put any stock in some sort of off the books "understanding." Secondly, Microsoft funded Vanguard with three times as much capital as Everquest required and Sigil was barely able to deliver an unfinished and ultimately doomed game.

McQuaid then bungled the kickstarter for Pantheon, further harming his already tattered reputation. I followed the Pantheon thread on rerolled for months and was amused by all the glee at Brad's latest failure but, credit where credit is due. The gameplay for Pantheon looks like Halgarad area. I'd love to play in that sort of world again with a game with an EQ feel. I hope it makes it to beta so I can play it.

Meanwhile I hold out little hope that vgemu will ever be able to launch a complete game, specifically a complete PvP game, which is what I would be interested in playing. But I think they've already exceeded meager expectations and I look forward to seeing what they will accomplish. I'll say it again ... I freaking loved Vanguard, flaws and all, and only wish more people could have seen past the shortcomings to appreciate the amazing game underneath.