Weighted Point Value System - Serverwide Raid Idea Thread

[Yinikren]

Sorry Stealin, I haven't gone back forum surfing - it is 4am and I am sleepy. Anyway, it's also one of the reasons we could use a raid subforum - every mob could have a thread discussion about their point cost relative to the whole system.

[Autotune]

Originally Posted by Lazie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No I am proposing a system to get people their gear off mobs like VS and their epics to compete on mobs like Trak and in the future VP. I am proposing a system that will make progression possible on the server and keep the high end of the game still tough to access but possible with work. You are just adding bias that isn't there.

No, I know exactly what several people are thinking. They don't want a point system because Trakanon will be valued extremely high and the few top end guilds want him FFA to discourage other guilds from trying to key up to VP. The goal has always been to block other guilds from VP.

Forcing guilds to limit themselves with raids per week if they want to cockblock VP is a great idea. Go ahead and block it, spend the points for the high value targets and while the few guilds are doing that, the other guilds will be able to clean house on all the other targets and a few epic mobs.

[Yinikren]

Originally Posted by Autotune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No, I know exactly what several people are thinking. They don't want a point system because Trakanon will be valued extremely high and the few top end guilds want him FFA to discourage other guilds from trying to key up to VP. The goal has always been to block other guilds from VP.

Forcing guilds to limit themselves with raids per week if they want to cockblock VP is a great idea. Go ahead and block it, spend the points for the high value targets and while the few guilds are doing that, the other guilds will be able to clean house on all the other targets and a few epic mobs.

Summed it up perfectly. Other than my shitty points costs, but at least its easy to add in your head! I wanted Maestro to cost less, but then it wouldn't go evenly into 100 and I didn't want him to be free.... =P

[Lazie]

Originally Posted by Autotune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No, I know exactly what several people are thinking. They don't want a point system because Trakanon will be valued extremely high and the few top end guilds want him FFA to discourage other guilds from trying to key up to VP. The goal has always been to block other guilds from VP.

Forcing guilds to limit themselves with raids per week if they want to cockblock VP is a great idea. Go ahead and block it, spend the points for the high value targets and while the few guilds are doing that, the other guilds will be able to clean house on all the other targets and a few epic mobs.

Wrong again. What people want is to keep competition. If you put this point system in place NO ONE outside of TMO/FE/IB/BDA is going to kill Trak because those are the guilds that will have the points and willingness to track him. Guess what ? Those are the same guilds with VP keys already. The same mobs will get rotated beyond TMO/FE/IB/BDA once those 3 entities spend their points and it will be a crap shoot to finish epics.

In the system I proposed all guilds that want to get on the epic mobs would have a shot to do so and earn their epics.

[Autotune]

Originally Posted by Lazie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Wrong again. What people want is to keep competition. If you put this point system in place NO ONE outside of TMO/FE/IB/BDA is going to kill Trak because those are the guilds that will have the points and willingness to track him. Guess what ? Those are the same guilds with VP keys already. The same mobs will get rotated beyond TMO/FE/IB/BDA once those 3 entities spend their points and it will be a crap shoot to finish epics.

In the system I proposed all guilds that want to get on the epic mobs would have a shot to do so and earn their epics.

Why would they not have the points to go for trak? I'm very curious as to why that is and guilds already don't want to track, that's why they are pushing to have variance reduced to make the raid scene more classic and more friendly.

[Yinikren]

Uhm, no. Any guild that kills Trak spends a large amount of points to do so. They can keep trak down all they want, at the cost of leaving up VP and epic mobs to do so. That's the point of this system - guilds have to choose what they want to kill. Making trak FFA isn't going to enable any more guilds to kill him. Its just going to make him be killed even faster because the guilds who might not be able to kill him because they are capped on points can kill him anyway.

[Yinikren]

In fact, I would go so far to say that it is simply unfeasible for most guilds to attempt Trak - too many guilds already have raid forces camped down there. A points system would help eliminate this issue because not all of those guilds may want to engage trak, if they would rather do epics or VP for loot.

[Lazie]

Originally Posted by Autotune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Why would they not have the points to go for trak? I'm very curious as to why that is and guilds already don't want to track, that's why they are pushing to have variance reduced to make the raid scene more classic and more friendly.

I didn't say remove points for Trak... But If TMO doesn't kill Trak and doesn't spend points on him the line of succession will be FE/IB>BDA with their points. The same 3 guilds already VP keyed. You will just be supplying those 3 guilds VP and VP keys without competition at all. The only Competition will be who wins the mobs they want for the week and then they will spread their points to the next best mobs.

You will have the same situation you just said big guilds want. People locked out of VP with this system. But with this system you will also have no guarantee that all guilds will get a shot at their epic mobs. It is just full of flaws of what most people want. A chance to finish their epic and to progress on the server while maintaining competition.

[Autotune]

Originally Posted by Lazie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I didn't say remove points for Trak... But If TMO doesn't kill Trak and doesn't spend points on him the line of succession will be FE/IB>BDA with their points. The same 3 guilds already VP keyed. You will just be supplying those 3 guilds VP and VP keys without competition at all. The only Competition will be who wins the mobs they want for the week and then they will spread their points to the next best mobs.

You will have the same situation you just said big guilds want. People locked out of VP with this system. But with this system you will also have no guarantee that all guilds will get a shot at their epic mobs. It is just full of flaws of what most people want. A chance to finish their epic and to progress on the server while maintaining competition.

more vp keys for FE/IB/BDA hurts no one but TMO and opens up more of the raid scene outside of VP by putting more of a raid scene inside of VP.

The guilds that aren't able to compete in VP will have little problem with more guilds moving into VP, considering even if they had trak to themselves it would take a single guild months to key into VP now.

[Yinikren]

What if IBFE had already spent their points in VP that week? What if BDA decided to go after Inny for ranger epics? Every guild has to give up something to farm trak. I am not sure how else I can possibly explain this. There is no better solution for giving trak to other guilds short of handing him to them in a rotation. The best way to do this is to preoccupy guilds with something else. Nothing is going to stop a guild from killing trak, but then you get to attempt the mobs they willingly gave up to kill him in the first place.