Thinking of making a wizard

[Lojik]

Originally Posted by Mateo [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

2k damage is .66% of Vindicator's hp..

Oh wow wizards confirmed suck. Gonna delete mine now.

[Motec]

Originally Posted by Mateo [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

2k damage is .66% of Vindicator's hp..

No wizard in their right mind wastes peridots on vindicator. Not that you have porlo's/hsagra's so early in velious, and sunstrike lands well on a malo/ro'd vindi anyway.

Tormax is where a wizard shines. Monk/rog DPS is absolutely lame against tormax AC. A couple of wiz/nec and he goes down like a sack.

[Tecmos Deception]

Originally Posted by melton80 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

By alot of the comments on this post i can tell alot of you know close to nothing about a wizard, a wizard isnt suppose to be sustained DPS they are a burst class, like comparing apples to oranges. I can tell alot of u r just sheep repeating what others say cause they been in bad groups with a wizard. But remember if u can, comparing a burst class with a sustained dps class is stupid, they r 2 totally different kinds of dps.

Well, in a perfect world, you'd be 100% right.

1615 damage for a sunstrike every ~9.5 seconds is 170+ DPS. That's a ton, right? Close to double what a rogue will do sustained in a level 60 group grinding level 50+ mobs. Except that landing a sunstrike is going to be a ton of aggro and it can be resisted, especially if you're fighting something that is so buff that you're freaking out about needing to burn it down asap. At lower levels the problems are the same: wizards can do burst damage theoretically but they probably will just be getting aggro and having to stun/kite/channel/manage aggro, all of which will decrease damage by a lot.

I'd be surprised to witness a 60 wizard do over 100 DPS "burst" (meaning DPS over the course of a single NPC's life) in a group situation without it being more trouble than it's worth (sure you did 140 DPS on Emperor Chottal, but doing so got you dotted twice and beat to hell which OOMed the cleric and annoyed all the rest of the group cause the mob was summoning and changing facing so the rogues weren't able to backstab, etc). Meanwhile the rogue/monk/charmers are doing 70-100 DPS sustained, perhaps 150 burst if you're looking at a charmer who is also casting for damage or a monk/rogue with disc.

I would love to be proven wrong though!

[Lojik]

Originally Posted by Tecmos Deception [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Well, in a perfect world, you'd be 100% right.

1615 damage for a sunstrike every ~9.5 seconds is 170+ DPS. That's a ton, right? Close to double what a rogue will do sustained in a level 60 group grinding level 50+ mobs. Except that landing a sunstrike is going to be a ton of aggro and it can be resisted, especially if you're fighting something that is so buff that you're freaking out about needing to burn it down asap. At lower levels the problems are the same: wizards can do burst damage theoretically but they probably will just be getting aggro and having to stun/kite/channel/manage aggro, all of which will decrease damage by a lot.

I'd be surprised to witness a 60 wizard do over 100 DPS "burst" (meaning DPS over the course of a single NPC's life) in a group situation without it being more trouble than it's worth (sure you did 140 DPS on Emperor Chottal, but doing so got you dotted twice and beat to hell which OOMed the cleric and annoyed all the rest of the group cause the mob was summoning and changing facing so the rogues weren't able to backstab, etc). Meanwhile the rogue/monk/charmers are doing 70-100 DPS sustained, perhaps 150 burst if you're looking at a charmer who is also casting for damage or a monk/rogue with disc.

I would love to be proven wrong though!

Well they can manage hate a little bit with root/snare/stuns and also concussion, plus if you time the bursts towards the end of the mobs life they can't retaliate. Also using lure of ice can help prevent generating unnecessary aggro, and I don't think that will be resisted by any mob that a standard group is going to take down. Wizards are nice to have against enraging mobs, maybe rampaging but i forget what that effect does. Also, I assume you are excluding aoe groups when talking about burst dps.

[Tecmos Deception]

Originally Posted by Lojik [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Well they can manage hate a little bit with root/snare/stuns and also concussion, plus if you time the bursts towards the end of the mobs life they can't retaliate. Also using lure of ice can help prevent generating unnecessary aggro, and I don't think that will be resisted by any mob that a standard group is going to take down. Wizards are nice to have against enraging mobs, maybe rampaging but i forget what that effect does.

These are reasons why wizards' burst damage is cool if you're talking purely theoretically, but crappy when you're talking about a real group. The only ways they can manage to actually do burst damage reduce the burst damage they can do.

Snares, roots, and concussion don't do any damage; stuns hardly do any damage. Lures do lower DPS and consume more mana. Nuking hard at the end of mob's life is burst, but the number of times you actually need to burn something down extra quickly when it is low on life are very low. Not many things enrage, and it isn't a big deal anyway cause the tank turns off autoattack if he doesn't want to get riposted and enrage wears off in like 10 seconds anyways.

WoW needs mobs bursted at certain junctures in fights. P99 really does not. And since that is basically the only thing a wizard has going for him (and even then, he really doesn't)... yeah.

[Morningbreath]

Originally Posted by Tecmos Deception [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

These are reasons why wizards' burst damage is cool if you're talking purely theoretically, but crappy when you're talking about a real group. The only ways they can manage to actually do burst damage reduce the burst damage they can do.

Snares, roots, and concussion don't do any damage; stuns hardly do any damage. Lures do lower DPS and consume more mana. Nuking hard at the end of mob's life is burst, but the number of times you actually need to burn something down extra quickly when it is low on life are very low. Not many things enrage, and it isn't a big deal anyway cause the tank turns off autoattack if he doesn't want to get riposted and enrage wears off in like 10 seconds anyways.

WoW needs mobs bursted at certain junctures in fights. P99 really does not. And since that is basically the only thing a wizard has going for him (and even then, he really doesn't)... yeah.

Back on Live at some point SOE recognized that mages were having a hard time soloing because they kept pulling aggro off their pets with their nukes. It was never mentioned in any patch notes but at some point they DRASTICALLY lowered the aggro on mage nukes. I don't know when they did it but it must have been after Kunark.

Net result? Mages could chain cast nukes without getting aggro. In a cruel twist of fate they became better burners than wizards while their pet provided steady, mana-free DPS that was competitive with melee DPS.

[Picked]

I am just now going through leveling another wizard up. I didn't find it that bad. I was twinked. So it let me kill a lot of stuff before sitting to med. It made medding to full a little bit more brutal. But it's nice to burn off a tank of mana and go do something productive while you wait. Watching a show on Netflix or Hulu even.

When in a group a wizards dps is not all that bad. Is it a rogue with epic kind of dps? No. Is it a rogue with regular gear? Close. Just don't AFK a lot and make sure you keep using your mana. It will be a noticeable difference. Plus when they see the wizard standing to nuke and suddenly the mobs life drops 30% they will be glad to have you. Also make friends with enchanters. If there is one around be polite but ask them for clarity or breeze. Makes you twice as effective.

Being a wizard is like any other class. The player makes the difference. It's not hard being a good wizard. It just takes a little dedication.

And I vehemently disagree with Wizard solo not being good EXP. Especially when they are able to quad kite. The exp is about as good as it gets. First few levels are rough like people have said. But get in groups. Let them help you get there.

And put all your stat points into Int/Str. Stamina does virtually nothing for wizards. It may give you 5 more hps. Not worth it.

[Andervin]

Originally Posted by Tecmos Deception [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

...and annoyed all the rest of the group cause the mob was summoning and changing facing so the rogues weren't able to backstab, etc).

This always bugged the shit out of me. How hard is it to go stand by the tank while blasting so if you do get aggro the mob doesn't move and the tank can snatch aggro back faster? They should also be rune tanking if they draw aggro to spare the cleric's mana. I always told the healers not to bother with me until I as under like 30%. If I was getting beat on too much it was my own damned fault.

To the guy that says wizzies are burst dps... very true. They are a "this shit needs to die now" dps class. In a normal xp group their dps is going to be hindered by mana regen. Get some crack and bard in the group and watch the frak out.