Why is training allowed on p99 in veeshan's peak? (poll asking your opinion)

[Faerie]

Originally Posted by Tasslehofp99 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

To be honest I think it was not allowed on any server. I only mentioned the pvp servers because I never played on one during live so couldn't say.


There is basically no evidence that training was ever allowed or an acceptable stratedgy for one guild to use against another. In fact on live entire guilds were disbanded for intentional training.


Lets fix this major flaw in the p99 raiding scene bros, lets not let an oily minority group on the server decide how we should spend our time on p99. Why should one guild be allowed to Train another in any zone? There's no justification for it other than to grief your competition and waste peoples time.

It was allowed on Sullon Zek, and only Sullon Zek.

The Sullon Zek Server (Deity based team PvP)

The Sullon Zek server is a new server with a new rule set. The rules for this server are very different than those on any other EverQuest server. In general the server is based on the concept of a PvP teams server, like Tallon and Vallon Zek, but with the teams chosen based on which god the character worships rather than the race of the character.

Sullon Zek rules:

1. Player v. Player (PvP) combat can occur between any characters that are not on the same team, regardless of level. A level 50 character can attack and kill a level 6 character if that character is not a member of his alliance. But rules 2 and 3 apply.

2. Characters will be immune to PvP combat until they have gained enough strength to survive the struggle. Characters below 6th level are not able to participate in PvP combat, unless they stray from city and newbie zones. As soon as a character 'dings' into 6th level he or she will become PvP enabled.

3. Characters will lose experience when killed in PvP combat if the character that killed them is within 5 levels. The amount of experience lost will be the same amount that is lost if that character is killed by an NPC. Your corpse can be resurrected by a cleric to partially restore lost experience.

4. Characters will only be able to loot coins from other characters, and then only if the victim was within 5 levels of the killer. Only the character getting the killing blow will be able to loot the corpse.

5. Players may only have one character at a time on this server. This means that you will have to delete the existing character in order to create a new one. Because we are introducing a new class and a new race with the release of Shadows of Luclin we plan to make allowances at that time for those that wish to explore these new characters.

6. Characters will not be able to group with anyone that is not on their Deity Team.

7. Characters will not be able to invite someone to join their guild that is not on their Deity Team.

8. Combat skills' effective value is capped at 2 levels above a players current level.

9. Resistance debuff spells have a 50% increased effectiveness against player characters.

10. /consider returns only three kinds of results when used against player characters. 'Green' means that the character is below your range. 'White' or 'black' means that the character is within your range. 'Red' means that they are above your range. 'In range' means +/- 5 levels.

11. /consider will also display a message indicating what team the target is on. Members of your own team will be displayed as an 'ally'.

12. Faction hits for PvP will be taken for killing characters within their racial home towns. Killing a human in any human starting city will cause a faction loss with the locals. Freeport, Qeynos and Surefall Glade are considered starting cities for humans. All of Greater Faydark and Felwithe are considered the starting city for all elves (high elves and wood elves), except dark elves. Paineel and Erudin are both starting cities for erudites, and killing one in either city (regardless of their place of origin) will result in a faction loss with that city. Other cities are not considered home towns, despite being run and controlled by a certain race. For example, HighHold is not a human home town. Thurgadin is not a dwarven home town.

13. Rules such as the Play Nice Policy do not apply to this server. Characters have the ability on this server to deal with their conflicts through combat. Causing experience loss by 'training' NPCs on other characters is not an offense that would warrant a warning this server. HOWEVER: All rules regarding general decency still apply. Cursing, threats and other such things will be dealt with sternly, and are still unacceptable behavior on any PvP server.

14. Beneficial effects can not be used on members of another team.

15. No character will be able to bind in dungeon zones.

16. 'Buff' spells will not affect characters more than 20 levels lower than the spell level. Existing spell restrictions on spells over 50th level will supercede this rule.

17. There will be 'insignia' dropped on the corpses of characters over 20th level that are killed by another character. We plan to allow those to be turned in for a reward of some sort. What that reward will be is undetermined at this time, but we are leaning towards a team reward rather than a personal reward.

18. Naked corpses will disappear when looted by a player character. If you are naked and killed by a player character, your corpse will disappear when it is looted.

The 'Teams':

The Good Alliance consists of: Erollisi Marr, Mithaniel Marr, Rodcet Nife, Quellious, Tunare
The Evil Alliance consists of: Bertoxxulous, Cazic Thule, Innoruuk, Rallos Zek
The Neutral Alliance consists of: Brell Serilis, Bristlebane, Karana, Prexus, Solusek Ro, The Tribunal, Veeshan.

There are no Agnostics on Sullon Zek. With the new influence of the gods, those that had not declared for one deity or another have been killed. Everyone now worships a deity, if not out of respect, love or fear of the god, then out of fear for their lives at the hands of fanatics.
Barbarian Shaman and Warriors can choose to worship Mithaniel Marr. Mithaniel Marr was unwilling to abandon all of the noble barbarians that served the good, and many declared themselves in favor of an alliance with Good.
Monks will be able to worship Veeshan. The Temple in Qeynos has discovered some ancient writings that opened up new avenues.
We will be including a method for the Good and Neutral teams to use Summon Corpse or something similar.

[timhutton]

Originally Posted by Faerie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Training was most certainly not allowed on Vallon Zek (PvP Teams).

Training was not allowed anywhere, on either blue or PVP. See 2 posts up, last image for PVP server ruling.

*edit: read your rules on sullon.. not sure where you got them from, but assuming they are legit then yes these rules would not have applied to sz!

[Alorae]

...implying that "classic" is defined by however it may or may not have been on Fennin Ro.

Was not like that at all on any of the servers I played on. The GMs did not allow that shit.

[Zeelot]

I'm not implying that. Obviously every server is different. Everyone had a different EQ experience due to totally different server environments. We could debate all day long which would be the most 'classic' ruleset, but there was no standardized ruleset. Disputes were handled differently on every server.

Thus, the GMs here do it their way and I respect that. Personally I think the community should let them set the rules the way they want without complaints.

[Tasslehofp99]

Originally Posted by Zeelot [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'm not implying that. Obviously every server is different. Everyone had a different EQ experience due to totally different server environments. We could debate all day long which would be the most 'classic' ruleset, but there was no standardized ruleset. Disputes were handled differently on every server.

Thus, the GMs here do it their way and I respect that. Personally I think the community should let them set the rules the way they want without complaints.

I agree the GMs should make the rules without backlash from players. However when the final raiding zone in the game has been given a non classic ruleset that no longer fits the majority of the players who raid here then it may be time to atleast discuss some changes.

I think there are 3 or 4 guilds with vp keyed players in them at this point and only one of them raids VP regularly. This isn't due to other guilds inability to kill dragons in this zone but more likely due to the fact that most of us aren't interested in having 8 hour train fests to have one engage on a mob. It wasn't like this on live so to expect any guilds to invest that amount of time just to have a shot at.dragon is unreasonable.

Why is it unreasonable to want to discuss changes to a nonclassic rule that no longer works for the majority of raiders on p99?

There are no reasons that I can think of to keep training legal in vp other than it keeping petitions down in numbers for the gms. But if training was outlawes and enforced the way it is outside of VP there shouldn't be an issue really. If this is the case what happen.s when velious opens and tons more mobs are added to the raid scene? Lets end sanctioned training now before velious hits so we have an overall better, less asstastic, raiding experience.

I don't see how allowing training in one zone due to overload on the petition queue makes sense when in velious there will be 100 more mobs contested and lots more players.

It just seems silly now.

[timhutton]

Lol I found this map folded up in between the pages of my guide.. I think this is the map from EQTrilogy.. can anyone confirm/deny? Glad I opened this up today, might get this framed.. it's brand new [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

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[sanforce]

I was watching Tiggles stream earlier tonight. When TMO went into VP, the ONLY people that were training were FE monks that were trying to delay the inevitable dragon kills. FE wasn't even attempting the mobs, they were just there to grief (2 monks - Xerxes and Huen I believe, and 1 cleric - Goodies). TMO wasn't crying, they laughed and shrugged it off, and then got the kills anyways. I don't see why other guild can't use some coordination and get the same thing accomplished. They must just all be that bad - can't handle the rules so the /cry and try to get the rules changed because their eq skills and organization is sub par. It's also unfortunate when FE griefs in VP because it gets the streams shut down. That being said, I think it is a nice change of pace from the other raid encounters, and I think that FE should be allowed to train in there if they want, even if they never actually attempt a VP mob.

[Tasslehofp99]

Originally Posted by sanforce [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I was watching Tiggles stream earlier tonight. When TMO went into VP, the ONLY people that were training were FE monks that were trying to delay the inevitable dragon kills. FE wasn't even attempting the mobs, they were just there to grief (2 monks - Xerxes and Huen I believe, and 1 cleric - Goodies). TMO wasn't crying, they laughed and shrugged it off, and then got the kills anyways. I don't see why other guild can't use some coordination and get the same thing accomplished. They must just all be that bad - can't handle the rules so the /cry and try to get the rules changed because their eq skills and organization is sub par. It's also unfortunate when FE griefs in VP because it gets the streams shut down. That being said, I think it is a nice change of pace from the other raid encounters, and I think that FE should be allowed to train in there if they want, even if they never actually attempt a VP mob.

Well you're bringing up 2 or 3 people playing within the rules given to them, not sure what relevance your post has within this thread. If people want to go spend hours training and it is allowed by the current rules, why would they not? That would be their prerogative.


My thread was meantvto gauge the servers players opinion of the situation and perhaps open the doors to discussion regarding altering the rules.

If you want to bring up FE or specific members of FE please do so on rants and flames.


The issue here is not TMO/IB/FE or their storied pasts on this server, its the rules in the final raid zone available to players here. Training being allowed there just further fosters guilds animosity as well as requiring them to bloat their rosters to immense sizes just to be able to compete.


You wanna zone into vp with your guild? Better have at the very least 10 players ready to train for hours on end just to get a clean pull. Then you wanna engage thay dragon? Better make sure you kill every opposing guild member in zone first. Don't forget all it takes is a ninja rezzed monk or two to train a guild engaged to a mob in vp.

In other words VP under the current system is complete idiocy. You can sit here and bring up FE or IB or TMO, but lets be real, it really isn't up to any of them. Atleast I hope it isn't.


This is about staying true to what p99 (atleast I thought) was meant to be.
Lets try to look past petty differences and do whats right for the server.


The funny thing is I sincerely feel that VP without training would be a lot more fun, and less time would be wasted with idiotic training. I don't understand, training isn't a sign of skill but rather the lack thereof. To me, being able to race to a mob and engage it without training one another would be a much greater indicator of skill.

[Tasslehofp99]

On live, trainers were shunned.
On p99 trainers are praised.

Dafuq?

[Autotune]

Originally Posted by Tasslehofp99 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

On live, trainers were shunned.
On p99 trainers are praised.

Dafuq?

Apparently not all trainers are praised, just the ones who do good jobs in VP.