Ragefire Agreement/Rotation

[falkun]

Originally Posted by Glitterati [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Only cause I just woke up =)

Dumesh has a good point, 30 minutes is too short. I also like whoever said new guilds entering into the rotation just be put onto the end of whatever the original rotation order is. Once this gets rolling and we're two, three months into this and it's going smoothly, it won't matter who was first, it'll move in an infinite loop with manaless rezzes and peace for everyone.

Still waiting for a guild to abuse this by changing names all the time and just appending themselves to the end of the list. My idea adresses this. It also does not allow any new guild to interfere with the current iteration, only the next, being fair to the guilds still waiting patiently in line for their turn in that iteration.

[Autotune]

Originally Posted by Extunarian [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't find it confusing at all. Designated time at the end of every rotation cycle for another guild to try to join. Plus the guild attempting wouldn't have to forfeit their epic piece to the guild on rotation that allowed them to try.

The problem with this, is you effectively push back another guild for no other reason but for another to attempt. At the same time, if the applying guild fails their ragefire, they are left with the delima of losing their loot to another guild. To be fair to both the guilds on the rotation and the applying guild, it's best to do it the way i mentioned imo. Unless you can think of another way the applying guild doesn't forfeit their epic turnin and the guilds on the rotation don't get pushed back.

Originally Posted by Dumesh Uhl'Belk [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Thanks for putting this out there.

I hate to be the first guild leader to come along and say "Yes, but..."

However...

Yes, 30 sounds great and all as long as the spawn times are between 2am and 5pm on a workday. It seems like all that has to happen for the rotation to be abused is for effort or random chance to shift the Ragefire spawn times such that BDA, Taken, and Div don't have enough people online to claim their spot in the rotation, with only 30 minutes, I see guilds that have a 24 hour presence claiming a ton of Ragefires while potentially managing the respawn timers to lock other member of the rotation out.

I propose changing the forfeiture to the first instance of 10pm eastern time after Ragefire spawns or 1 hour, whichever is longer.

If people can agree on that, consider Divinity signed up.

I'm going to leave this up to you guys all now. I laid ground work.

I've attempted to get VD to agree, but seems they've decided to petition for rule changes.

[Autotune]

Originally Posted by falkun [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Still waiting for a guild to abuse this by changing names all the time and just appending themselves to the end of the list. My idea adresses this. It also does not allow any new guild to interfere with the current iteration, only the next, being fair to the guilds still waiting patiently in line for their turn in that iteration.

you can't abuse it, there is a majority vote for a reason.

[Velion]

Originally Posted by Autotune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'm going to leave this up to you guys all now. I laid ground work.

I've attempted to get VD to agree, but seems they've decided to petition for rule changes.

Seriously, wtf are you even talking about? I don't see any actual guild leadership signing off on this except for Taken (with a few suggestions) and you're going to try to stir up some shit with VD? Even your own guild leader has had nothing to say about this and seeing as your reputation mainly consists of being a forum troll, I doubt anyone takes your word at face value.

[Flunklesnarkin]

A list strikes the right balances of fairness to stronger guilds and weaker guilds.


no need to make it more complicated lol


new guild wants in on rotation they get their shot... if they wipe... guilds hanging out can random for it or something.


Either way established guild will get an extra ragefire if weaker guild wipes and get done faster.

[Autotune]

Originally Posted by Velion [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Seriously, wtf are you even talking about? I don't see any actual guild leadership signing off on this except for Taken (with a few suggestions) and you're going to try to stir up some shit with VD? Even your own guild leader has had nothing to say about this and seeing as your reputation mainly consists of being a forum troll, I doubt anyone takes your word at face value.

aye, your guild can only agree if my guild agrees.

Has to start somewhere.

I commend taken and div for giving it a shot. I put it out there and i am sure the majority of TMO members would make it go thru (especially the clerics, which are the ones who matter)

Leaving it up to guild leaders means it's not going anywhere.

The first rotation was done with members and no officers/leaders and it went perfectly. Your guild leaders are holding you back.

[falkun]

Originally Posted by Autotune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Rotation Order:

Div, BDA, Taken, VD, TMO, IB

this is on a 1-1-1-1-1-1

Rules:

1) 30mins to engage for the kill
2) can be assisted if you can get the help within the time allowed
3) If you can't engage in 30mins and kill your Ragefire, you forfeit your turn to the next guild on the rotation.
4) If you fail twice in a row, you will be removed from the rotation.

How to get on the rotation:

To get on the rotation, a guild will have to apply to be considered. Then a guild will allow them to attempt to kill a Ragefire. This will be done by a guild willing currently on the rotation spawning the Ragefire for the guild. The applying guild will then a chance to kill the Ragefire to prove they deserve the spot on the rotation. ALL LOOT WILL GO TO THE GUILD THAT SPAWNED RAGEFIRE. If the guild fails, they must wait 2 weeks to reapply for consideration. The applying guild cannot receive outside help to be added and will be bound by all other rules described above. (any attempt to ninjaloot drops will remove the guild from any consideration to be added permanently)

This rotation will allow the guilds with the most completed cleric epics to keep the most, while everyone also obtains a cleric epic at the same rate.

Guilds will not be required to kill a naggy.


Any problems with this?

Originally Posted by Autotune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

you can't abuse it, there is a majority vote for a reason.

Where does it state majority vote? I see a guild applies for a spot on the rotation, then a guild (any guild) allows them to attempt.

Originally Posted by Autotune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'm going to leave this up to you guys all now. I laid ground work.

I've attempted to get VD to agree, but seems they've decided to petition for rule changes.

Way to try to spin my words. You must be referring to this post:

Originally Posted by falkun [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You have less ability to manipulate timers with a half hour window than you do with 1hr window that contains a time-zone specific caveat. You are imposing a caveat that by definition manages respawn timer due to geographic location. Why are you excluding the euros? Give everyone a fair shot at getting a shitty spawn time, not just the euro players.

If you want a 1hr window, I can understand that and go with it (not that I have a vote), but I would not advise an arbitrary time zone caveat.

In it I state I do not have a vote. I have also advocated for smaller guilds more than your proposed set of rules, see below:

Originally Posted by falkun [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Give test guilds the same standards as established guilds: you are allowed assistance as long as you stay within the time frame. This would allow smaller guilds the same opportunities as established guilds, no bias between those who already have stars and those who do not (dr. Seuss reference).

[Velion]

Originally Posted by Autotune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

aye, your guild can only agree if my guild agrees.

Has to start somewhere.

I commend taken and div for giving it a shot. I put it out there and i am sure the majority of TMO members would make it go thru (especially the clerics, which are the ones who matter)

Leaving it up to guild leaders means it's not going anywhere.

The first rotation was done with members and no officers/leaders and it went perfectly. Your guild leaders are holding you back.

There has been one guild leader constantly holding this back... I'll give you two guesses who it has been.

[falkun]

Originally Posted by Autotune [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Your guild leaders are holding you back.

That's funny coming from a tmo member. (Can't link cold's quotes, so click the link yourself)

Originally Posted by ElanoraBryght [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

We can't talk about who is technically where in the rotation, since there isn't a rotation yet. There could have been one. Look at your leadership for why there isn't.

Before the raid suspensions :


After the raid suspensions were handed out.


Hopefully the leaders will all be on to talk tonight.

[Splorf22]

+1 for the original Stealin proposal. It's the exact guild order I would have proposed as well, and probably for the same reasons.

Stealin has a reasonable way of adding guilds, but I don't think it's really necessary - if the leaders can't agree on a procedure there, just agree on 3-4 rotations (6-8 weeks I think) under the current system. By then everyone will have enough that it won't be such a huge issue.

Dumesh, this agreement is a huge win for Divinity/BDA/Taken getting the same number of slots as VD/IB/TMO. If you leave Ragefire up for 24 hours, everyone gets less. Aata has the right idea - just get some help for those AM spawns.