Best 4 person all caster/priest group

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Gloomlord [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I mean, even an idiot can figure this out.

A Shaman will not output the same DPS on a solo target as he will on a mob being destroyed by two hasted charms. He will also be wasting mana with dots, because they can't unleash their full duration.

It's so obvious it's irrelevant. The man is exhausting us so we get fed up with trying to talk sense into him.

You are correct that a Mage will generally out DPS a Shaman on a solo target. But how did you know that a Mage will do higher DPS on a solo target?

The answer is people /pet attack a single mob and record the DPS. You can do that in a group, or solo[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] This is how DPS parsing works for class comparisons.

Originally Posted by Gloomlord [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I actually did answer this exact question hundreds of pages ago.

You'd probably like to forget about that, right? Best pretend you weren't already defeated back then.

Careful, sociopath! Your mask is slipping!

It should be easy for you to repost or retype your answer if this is true.

[cyxthryth]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You are correct that a Mage will generally out DPS a Shaman on a solo target. But how did you know that a Mage will do higher DPS on a solo target?

The answer is people /pet attack a single mob and record the DPS. You can do that in a group, or solo[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] This is how DPS parsing works for class comparisons.

When DPS parsing there are typically actual players playing the classes that are parsing. Raw math and/or vacuum class capabilities simply do not translate into actual DPS as calculated during actual gameplay, so Raw math and vacuum "player-less" class capabilities are irrelevant to this discussion.

Please explain in detail how "the DPS will remain the same" in a group environment when "the DPS equation has been changed by outside variables" as you noted in the - direct- Quote(s) below?

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

in a group setting, there are too many variables out of your control that can skew the data

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Once you add in outside variables, that changes the DPS equation NOT because of what the class can do, but because of what other players are doing.

[cyxthryth]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It should be easy for you to repost or retype your answer if this is true.

It should be easy for you to explain in detail how/why the following 4 - direct - Quotes are NOT contradictory if that is true.

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Assuming your group plays correctly, you will DPS the same way every time, the same as if you were solo.

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I am very confident it won't change in a group scenario.

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

in a group setting, there are too many variables out of your control that can skew the data

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Once you add in outside variables, that changes the DPS equation NOT because of what the class can do, but because of what other players are doing.

[Gloomlord]

"You were right. I'm sorry"

This is a simple sentence, DSM. You're a big man, right?

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Gloomlord [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

"You were right. I'm sorry"

This is a simple sentence, DSM. You're a big man, right?

I will happily say that if you can provide evidence for your claims.

You still haven't answered my question:

If a Mage does 20 DPS in a group because the puller keeps killing their pet, and a Shaman does 50 DPS because they aren't relying on their pet for DPS, does that mean a Mage has lower DPS than a Shaman?

[cyxthryth]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I will happily say that if you can provide evidence for your claims.

You still haven't answered my question:

If a Mage does 20 DPS in a group because the puller keeps killing their pet, and a Shaman does 50 DPS because they aren't relying on their pet for DPS, does that mean a Mage has lower DPS than a Shaman?

It would absolutely mean THAT particular Mage performed lower Damage Per Second than THAT particular Shaman in THAT particular instance.

Again I will ask:

Originally Posted by cyxthryth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Let me ask you a question. Does the cause NEGATE the effect/result?

And again I will note that you have still not provided the definition you are using for "playing correctly", nor have you explained how the following 4 - direct - Quotes are not contradictory:

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Assuming your group plays correctly, you will DPS the same way every time, the same as if you were solo.

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I am very confident it won't change in a group scenario.

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

in a group setting, there are too many variables out of your control that can skew the data

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Once you add in outside variables, that changes the DPS equation NOT because of what the class can do, but because of what other players are doing.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by cyxthryth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It would absolutely mean THAT particular mage performed lower Damage Per Second than THAT particular Shaman in THAT particular instance.

Agreed. But that says nothing about the class's capabilities. It would still be factually true that Rogues are generally considered to be the highest average DPS class on P99, even if all of the Rogues on the server sucked and were out-DPSed by Shamans every time.

I already showed how your gaslighting of my comments is incorrect and poorly executed https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...postcount=4165 . You aren't making your case any stronger by constant reposting those quotes. It just makes you look silly.

[cyxthryth]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Agreed. But that says nothing about the class's capabilities. It would still be factually true that Rogues do more DPS than other classes most of the time, even if all of the Rogues on the server sucked and were out-DPSed by Shamans every time.

Yes, a shitty player will probably have a shitty parse, but that is not news to anybody in this thread and is not particularly relevant to the discussion.... unless... WAIT!

Are you low-key insinuating that you have refused to provide parses of yourself playing your Shaman in an environment relevant to this thread, simply because, you are afraid that might expose that you as a PLAYER simply CANNOT perform as you have fervently/adamantly argued that THE SHAMAN CLASS can; and possibly even NO PLAYER can perform on the Shaman class in the way you have fervently/adamantly argued it that could for tens? hundreds of posts?

Does this all basically boil down to You vs. Everyone "comparing Apples to Oranges" simply because you are choosing to act like there will be NO players actually piloting the characters in this hypothetical group - which is an unrealistic and laughable specification for you to attempt to apply to the conversation when OP did NOT specify any - is that what's going on here?

Can you please explain for the understanding of myself and the rest of the posters/participants and passersby who read this thread and for the sake of civil discussion, why/how the following - direct - Quotes are "not contradictory"?

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Assuming your group plays correctly, you will DPS the same way every time, the same as if you were solo.

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I am very confident it won't change in a group scenario.

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

in a group setting, there are too many variables out of your control that can skew the data

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Once you add in outside variables, that changes the DPS equation NOT because of what the class can do, but because of what other players are doing.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by cyxthryth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Are you low-key insinuating that you have refused to provide parses of yourself playing your Shaman in an environment relevant to this thread, simply because, you are afraid that might expose that you as a PLAYER simply CANNOT perform as you have fervently/adamantly argued that THE SHAMAN CLASS can; and possibly even NO PLAYER can perform on the Shaman class in the way you have fervently/adamantly argued it that could for tens? hundreds of posts?

I am not afraid of that at all. The "standard of evidence" in this thread is an incorrect pixelated screenshot of a DPS parse in a single group. It is silly to think people who have been trolling me for hundreds of pages are going to believe me if I posted a pixelated screenshot of a DPS parse in a single group showing a Shaman doing respectable DPS.

If my detractors want to actually group up and get video recorded with me, that would be great! This would really be the only way to actually prove this one way or another, because neither party can make excuses if they are both present in the group.

So far nobody has seriously taken up this offer.

I am responding to you for the sake of people who haven't read this thread, not because you are saying anything new. It is clear you are trolling, just as you have been for the last 300+ posts.

[cyxthryth]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I am not afraid of that at all. The "standard of evidence" in this thread is an incorrect pixelated screenshot of a DPS parse in a single group. It is silly to think people who have been trolling me for hundreds of pages are going to believe me if I posted a pixelated screenshot of a DPS parse in a single group showing a Shaman doing respectable DPS.

If my detractors want to actually group up and get video recorded with me, that would be great! This would really be the only way to actually prove this one way or another, because neither party can make excuses if they are both present in the group.

So far nobody has seriously taken up this offer.

Sorry, but I am not sure how the above Quote addresses the remaining content of my previous Post, therefore, I will re-post it and await your response:

Does this all basically boil down to You vs. Everyone "comparing Apples to Oranges" simply because you are choosing to act like there will be NO players actually piloting the characters in this hypothetical group - which is an unrealistic and laughable specification for you to attempt to apply to the conversation when OP did NOT specify any - is that what's going on here?

Can you please explain - in detail - for the understanding of myself and the rest of the posters/participants and passersby who read this thread and for the sake of civil discussion, why/how the following - direct - Quotes are "not contradictory"?

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Assuming your group plays correctly, you will DPS the same way every time, the same as if you were solo.

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I am very confident it won't change in a group scenario.

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

in a group setting, there are too many variables out of your control that can skew the data

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Once you add in outside variables, that changes the DPS equation NOT because of what the class can do, but because of what other players are doing.