Nordenwatch's Guide: Rags to Riches

[Orruar]

Loraen, that is fucking hilarious coming from you. Didn't you sort of try to burn down your guild before leaving? I won't be taking moral advice from you anytime soon.

[Nordenwatch]

Originally Posted by Orruar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Loraen, that is fucking hilarious coming from you. Didn't you sort of try to burn down your guild before leaving? I won't be taking moral advice from you anytime soon.

wtf did he do?

once again fuck you loraen

[Splorf22]

Originally Posted by Orruar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Didn't you sort of try to burn down your guild before leaving?

I'm guessing you're loading up your sentence with qualifiers because you know it's silly bullshit. I'm also guessing I hit a nerve there, if the best you can do is some random ad hominem.

[Orruar]

Originally Posted by Splorf22 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'm guessing you're loading up your sentence with qualifiers because you know it's silly bullshit. I'm also guessing I hit a nerve there, if the best you can do is some random ad hominem.

Also, that's the best I could do because your post was completely devoid of any relevant points. Make a point that actually addresses anything I was saying and maybe you'd get more of a response. And I still disagree wholeheartedly with your kitten torture theories.

[Splorf22]

Originally Posted by Orruar

I loaded my sentence with "qualifiers" because I didn't catch much of the story and don't really give a shit about P99 guild drama. That's also why there is a question mark on my sentence. A question mark denotes an attempt to gain more information about the situation.

So despite admitting to having no fucking clue, you felt justified in making strong statements about my moral compass. /facepalm

Originally Posted by Orruar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Also, that's the best I could do because your post was completely devoid of any relevant points. Make a point that actually addresses anything I was saying and maybe you'd get more of a response.

My point was that rather than quibbling about the legalistic definition of 'victim', a little compassion for a family torn apart by addiction was in order. Considering that you are desperately alternating between backpedaling, spinning, and throwing out random shit about kittens in an attempt to deflect it, I'd say its safe to say that regardless of your claims to the contrary you figured things out.

[Orruar]

Originally Posted by Splorf22 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

My point was that rather than quibbling about the legalistic definition of 'victim', a little compassion for a family torn apart by addiction was in order. Considering that you are desperately alternating between backpedaling, spinning, and throwing out random shit about kittens in an attempt to deflect it, I'd say its safe to say that regardless of your claims to the contrary you figured things out.

I guess the whole kitten thing went over your head. You got all righteous about a position I never took on this issue, and so I was doing the same to you. I'm sorry that I had to take the time to explain this to you. It should have been rather obvious if you were thinking clearly.

And will you please stop getting all morally indignant about some weird position you think I have taken here? I never said a family whose father goes and wastes all his money at the craps table doesn't have it bad. Certainly anyone would feel bad for that situation. But there is a difference between that situation and one where an actual crime has been committed. If you can't tell the difference, that's on you. Luckily civilized society is able to make such distinctions.

[Senix]

Originally Posted by Derubael [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

There's two main victims of RMT on P99.

The first is the RMT'ers themselves, and their integrity and character as a person. When you go to someone's house, you agree to abide by their rules. If you went to your friends house, said 'Don't worry pal, I won't smear shit on your walls' and then smear shit on their walls anyway, you're hurting your integrity as a human being. Similarly, when you come play on Project 1999, you are in Nilbog and Rogean's house, and you've agreed to abide by their rules. When you decide to break those rules, you're not only violating their trust in you as a player, but hurting your character in the process.

In addition to that, you're taking advantage of a free game that Nilbog, Rogean, and the Development Team work hard to provide for you, pouring their own time, money, and resources into maintaining. Instead of spending money on platinum, you could have been donating your money to the server that provides you with a wealth of entertainment and friendships. Every time money is spent on platinum, you're essentially spitting in the face of the people who provide you this free service.

Playing on this server is a privilege, not a right, and we all greatly enjoy being able to help facilitate the use of that privilege. But the moment you take advantage of that, or help someone else take advantage of that (funding people who sell RMT), we're going to remove that privilege because you are insulting the people who gave it to you in the first place.

Arguments could be made that it hurts the economy, or that it cheapens the experience, but that's not the big issue here. If you love classic Everquest, support the people who help you experience that free of charge - not the people making money off of Nilbog and Rogean's generosity, kindness, and love of the game.

The second victim is me, because it takes stupid amounts of time to track all of this down [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]. That's CSR time that would be much better spent helping the player-base. So in a way, you're all victims too.

That's my 2pp.
tl;dr Support the project, not the people taking advantage of it. Also don't be a scumbag.

Dat slope is soooooo slippery.

If this honestly is the best argument the staff has against RMT I would have just kept it to myself. At least through silence some might think that the Staff knows something we don't or whatever. But you laying it out and showing your hand like that just shows that it is in fact victimless.

[Frieza_Prexus]

Originally Posted by Senix [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Dat slope is soooooo slippery.

Not really. They've devoted thousands of hours to making this server available to the public, and one of the few rules is no RMT. Not respecting that is loose butthole.

Additionally, how do you know they've shown their hand? There very well might be an actual agreement with Sony that RMT must not occur past a certain point or we'll be shut down. There's no reason to think that they'd disclose such an agreement for a variety of reasons.

[Senix]

Originally Posted by Frieza_Prexus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Not really. They've devoted thousands of hours to making this server available to the public, and one of the few rules is no RMT. Not respecting that is loose butthole.

Additionally, how do you know they've shown their hand? There very well might be an actual agreement with Sony that RMT must not occur past a certain point or we'll be shut down. There's no reason to think that they'd disclose such an agreement for a variety of reasons.

I don't know that they've tipped their hand completely, but it was a def show of weakness if that's all they could muster.

There is also no reason to believe that such an agreement exists.

And finally one of their few rules is all but unenforceable in cases like this. The offending player is leaving, so go ahead and ban him, big deal. The buyers knew the inherent risk involved and can easily take steps to avoid banning their main accounts, since accounts are free. So how is this at all stopping RMT? It's not.

[Frieza_Prexus]

Originally Posted by Senix [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't know that they've tipped their hand completely, but it was a def show of weakness if that's all they could muster.

There is also no reason to believe that such an agreement exists.

And finally one of their few rules is all but unenforceable in cases like this. The offending player is leaving, so go ahead and ban him, big deal. The buyers knew the inherent risk involved and can easily take steps to avoid banning their main accounts, since accounts are free. So how is this at all stopping RMT? It's not.

They have next to zero teeth against Nordenwatch, and banning his account does very little to stop the flow, you're right. However, following where the money went absolutely puts a dent in it. Just look at Platlord's site right now. His entire inventory has been decimated.

When the dust settles all you have left is that a person decided to be a dick by cashing out when he said he wouldn't when he first started here. It's a lack of respect for the rules and the people who made this server possible. We certainly understand his temptation, and we all know why he did it. That still doesn't change the fact that it was extremely disrespectful to everyone else.

I think much of the outrage here isn't moral. Instead, I think a lot of it is hurt because the people who knew him expected better behavior from a person they knew as a friend and cohort.