Iksar Shaman - Solo Challenges?

[Troxx]

If you don't need FSI to win encounters, regen wins.

To steal from your playbook:

Thanks for conceding you are wrong and I am right!

/thread

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If you don't need FSI to win encounters, regen wins.

You have already agreed that regen is not necessary earlier in this thread.

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

A level 60 shaman with torpor doesn't need regen anymore.
I agree.
You agree.
We all agree!
They don't need a fungi tunic - drop it for vindi bp
They don't have to obsess about keeping regrowth up - it is LESS (but not entirely) relevent.
It's why a barbarian shaman at 60 functions so well. If regen was that important, a barbarian shaman would not be successful - but they are.

There is no disagreement here.

If no racials are necessary, then you are no longer comparing them based on necessity. You are comparing them based on which is better. This is FSI, which has been clearly shown with math and evidence in this thread. You still need to provide counter-evidence if you think what I have provided is wrong.

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Thanks for conceding you are wrong and I am right!

This doesn't work when you say it. This is because I am not ending a debate with insults, lies, and trolls. You lose a debate when you realize you cannot rebut points made, and thus must resort to insults, lies, and trolls in an attempt to win through underhanded methods.

[bcbrown]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Averages are how this game works.

Wait a second... you just told me that averages were meaningless and my calculation of expected values didn't make sense!

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You lose a debate when you realize you cannot rebut points made, and thus must resort to insults, lies, and trolls in an attempt to win through underhanded methods.

Indeed.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by bcbrown [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Wait a second... you just told me that averages were meaningless and my calculation of expected values didn't make sense!

This is a poor attempt at a troll. It shows you are grasping for straws.

The reason why you do not average out the damage that FSI prevents is because we are talking about a specific time period during individual fights, not overall damage prevented in an hour. We were discussing the first 17 seconds of a fight when the mob has not been slowed yet.

FSI prevents hundreds of damage when it triggers within the first 17 seconds of an encounter when the mob has not yet been slowed. Conversely, Troll/Iksar Regeneration will always provide 24 HP in the same timeframe of 17 seconds.

You essentially tried to pull a fast one and average out FSI's damage across an hour to make it seem similar to what you get from Regeneration in 17 seconds lol. It was very sad to see.

[bcbrown]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You essentially tried to pull a fast one and average out FSI's damage across an hour to make it seem similar to what you get from Regeneration in 17 seconds lol. It was very sad to see.

The expected damage mitigated by FSI in the first 17 (pre-slowed) seconds is 23, according to the calculations I posted (using numbers you provided). You're welcome to contest those calculations; there's several areas of wiggle room I can identify. But you have yet to do so.

I honestly did not expect it to come out exactly one less damage than regen does in the same period. That was pure coincidence. But it does bring a smile to my face.

 

I still think Ogre is probably the best choice if the most important aspect of gameplay you care about is endgame soloing

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by bcbrown [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The expected damage mitigated by FSI in the first 17 (pre-slowed) seconds is 23, according to the calculations I posted (using numbers you provided). You're welcome to contest those calculations; there's several areas of wiggle room I can identify. But you have yet to do so.

I honestly did not expect it to come out exactly one less damage than regen does in the same period. That was pure coincidence. But it does bring a smile to my face.

I just said why this incorrect. You are basically taking the average damage FSI reduces in an hour when taking into account the 8.5% trigger rate per fight, and then comparing it to an individual fight where FSI actually triggered. That is clearly incorrect. That is like saying Ice Spear of Solist only does 78 damage when you cast it in an individual fight, because spamming that spell over an hour is only 13 DPS. Icy Spear of Solist still does 1200 damage to an individual monster, even if the average spam DPS is 13. This is why Wizard nukes are still useful. Their average DPS is low, but they can kill an individual mob quickly.

The same logic with Wizard nukes applies to FSI. You aren't worried about the average damage that FSI reduces over an hour. You specifically want FSI's ability to reduce hundreds of points of damage within a short time period when it does trigger in an individual encounter.

[bcbrown]

If you're conceding that the statement:

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Averages are how this game works.

is incorrect, I withdraw my objection.

 

It annoys me that I have to build the structure of your argument for you, but the proper way to do this is to replace an average with a probability distribution: instead of DPS, which is an average, model damage taken as a normal distribution with a mean and standard deviation, and then calculate the probability of the damage taken exceeding some threshold. It'll be much less than 3%, probably between 1% and 0.1%, depending on the threshold. If you want assistance building that probability distribution, I can help.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by bcbrown [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If you're conceding that the statement:

I am not conceding. Everquest does work on averages. You are either trolling or don't understand the math. It is honestly hard to tell.

You are basically trying to claim spells like https://wiki.project1999.com/Ice_Spear_of_Solist only do 78 Damage every time you cast them, because spamming Ice Spear of Solist over an hour is roughly 13 DPS, assuming you meditate perfectly and have no mana regeneration buffs.

This is incorrect. An individual cast of Icy Spear of Solist does 1200 damage to the mob. You use Wizard nukes because Icy Spear of the Solist does 1200 damage in a short period of time. The purpose of Icy Spear of Solist is to burn down an individual mob quickly, not provide average DPS over an hour.

The same logic applies to FSI. You use FSI because it reduces hundreds of points of damage within a short period of time in an individual fight when it does trigger. You are not using it to try and reduce more damage per hour than passive regeneration.

[bcbrown]

You're saying that EQ works on averages, while also saying that the flaw in my argument is that I'm using averages. Please forgive my confusion.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by bcbrown [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You're saying that EQ works on averages, while also saying that the flaw in my argument is that I'm using averages. Please forgive my confusion.

I see you avoided my entire post. Please address what I said in my previous post: https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...&postcount=298