pvp guard assist questions

[hurtinu]

Everything but a few vendors attacked whoever had the lowest faction.. I remember as a druid if you had thorns on and soemone with higher faction hit you next to a guard the guard would attack you because you ahve lower faction and the thorns hurt the other guy.

[Samoht]

I like the SK scenario most since he's the most likely to get a last hit due to a high damage, instant cast nuke.

An SK works for days on his faction for a city (doesn't matter where - Freeport, FV, Kelethin, Rivervale) and gets it high enough so that it's higher than what yours starts with. He sees you with your unmodified faction sitting next to the guards for their protection.

He attacks you! The guards do not immediately assist.

You decide to fight back. Since he is the aggressor, the guards should not fight you either, right?

You dot him, you turn on auto attack, you start to cast a nuke and then he FD's. Combat ends, but your next tick/swing/cast hits. Suddenly, you're the aggressor, and your faction isn't as good as his.

The guards swarm you.

Assuming they don't insta-gib you, the SK watches and then pops up when you have just a sliver of health left to last-hit you using HT.

You get coined for defending yourself.

If the guards were indiscriminate, they would have defended you outright because the SK attacked. If you fought back, they would have gone after you once the SK was off of their hate list. If the SK feigned in an attempt to steal the last hit, they would have gone after him again, and he would have to wait for FD timer and hope for a second success with guards attacking.

The more I think about it, the more it seems like faction would play no role in that kind of system, which isn't what we're going for at all. There has to be a more sophisticated way to implement it so that three classes don't get a coin-you-at-the-guards-with-guard-help-for-free card, though.

[Slave]

Originally Posted by Samoht [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You decide to fight back. Since he is the aggressor, the guards should not fight you either, right?

Of course not. If you aggress him by taking a swing at him, the guards will look at your faction and if it is lower, attack you. It doesn't matter at all who attacked who first. This means that people with lower faction cannot defend themselves in range of guards or they will get attacked. This is the exact way it was.

[nilbog]

He attacks you! The guards do not immediately assist.

The guards should immediately assist if within range.

Originally Posted by Samoht [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If the guards were indiscriminate, they would have defended you outright because the SK attacked. If you fought back, they would have gone after you once the SK was off of their hate list. If the SK feigned in an attempt to steal the last hit, they would have gone after him again, and he would have to wait for FD timer and hope for a second success with guards attacking.

I haven't seen how it is coded. It might work exactly like this, but this was what I was saying. The guards should defend you outright because you, a friendly target, were attacked in their presence.

[nilbog]

Originally Posted by Slave [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If you aggress him by taking a swing at him, the guards will look at your faction and if it is lower, attack you. It doesn't matter at all who attacked who first. This means that people with lower faction cannot defend themselves in range of guards or they will get attacked. This is the exact way it was.

Not sure this is exactly how it works atm, but the system was just built. Rogean should be able to respond about specifics.

Originally Posted by Slave [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

All mobs in the game displayed this behavior, from griffons and rats to bards, PODs, and gods. It's what made the pvp servers so immersive and amazing.

The current method for adding protection is on an npc by npc basis. I can easily add to all guards, and all guildmasters. I am not sure how performance intensive it would be to make all npcs naturally work like this, though.

[Slave]

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The current method for adding protection is on an npc by npc basis. I can easily add to all guards, and all guildmasters. I am not sure how performance intensive it would be to make all npcs naturally work like this, though.

I think that adding mobs of interest within all towns should do it... most other outside mobs are KOS to everyone else anyway and if you manage to faction with them up to Dubious somehow, you could always use them as mobshields against aggressive players.

Wolves and bears saving druids was always awesome to watch though.

[Softcore PK]

Originally Posted by Diggles [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Are we going to see faction hits for kills inside of their respective cities as well?

I hope we do; this should be added in even if it's not classic.

[Galanteer]

almost everything assists as had been stated, and only when damage is dealt while the attacker and defender are in assist range. It was possible to stand out of range and nuke a person down and the guards did nothing. (SZ)

I remember watching a friend play an Ogre when the game was three weeks old. Some troll was in Oggok working at the forge, he wanted the forge, kicked the troll, and the guards killed the troll. (RZ) (contradicting my first statement -could have got changed very early)

I remember doing things like faction adjust the scion (luclin times) and the scion would assist. Dungeons like Guk -where you start non kos, could also be used (with a faction adjustment to get just ahead of the other) (SZ)

[Slave]

Originally Posted by Galanteer [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I remember watching a friend play an Ogre when the game was three weeks old. Some troll was in Oggok working at the forge, he wanted the forge, kicked the troll, and the guards killed the troll. (RZ) (contradicting my first statement -could have got changed very early)

The troll could have had a damage shield on. That would have caused the guards to see the damage and assist on it.

Originally Posted by Galanteer [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

almost everything assists as had been stated, and only when damage is dealt while the attacker and defender are in assist range. It was possible to stand out of range and nuke a person down and the guards did nothing. (SZ)

This is also how I remember it.

[Lemons]

Along with guard assist you should add faction hits, even if its not classic or not. This needs to be put in to retain players. I'm all for grief, but the balance issue between lowbie levels say 1-16 is insane, its to easy for someone to grief you if they are few levels higher then you between those lvls.

There is basically to much grief. The videos on the forums prove it. And it wont stop because its become a trend on the boards to basically show they are killing them off the server.

This whole issue needs a very quick response.