Game Mechanics: Instrument Mods

[Arrisard]

Originally Posted by hotstud [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I can see that almost everyone posting here has a different understanding of the situation except Lazor. I'll try to make it more straightforward...

You can start singing Selos with a drum equipped. After the song starts you can remove your drum and equip whatever you want and you'll still run at Selos drum speed until you restart the song. Even if it runs for 5 hours and you only equip a drum for the first pulse it will be drum modified the entire time.

I understood you perfectly when I said exactly the same thinger:

"Have the instrument equipped on initial cast completion = mod will last full duration of the spell no matter what you have equipped or switch to another song. This will continue on passively, as well."

It's when you say that the mod should be checked every pulse that I do not agree with. This would completely kill the juggling mechanic that has always been classic.

Basically, I agree with Uthgaard. Mod should be checked when cast, not the remaining pulses unless otherwise recast actively or passively. If it checked every pulse, there would be no juggling.

[hotstud]

Originally Posted by Arrisard [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Mod should be checked when cast, not the remaining pulses unless otherwise recast actively or passively..

Do you understand that isn't what is happening? THIS DOES NOT INVOLVE TWISTING INSTRUMENTS, IT INVOLVES LEAVING A SINGLE SONG RUNNING PASSIVELY WHILE CHANGING INSTRUMENTS. When the song is recast passively it doesn't update the modifier. I really don't know how many times I have to restate this..

Start Selos...
Equip drum.
You run faster. + mod
Unequip drum.
You run faster. + mod

That is broken or..

Start Selos...
No drum.
You run faster. - mod
Equip drum.
You run faster. + mod
Unequip drum.
You run faster. - mod



This is broken. There's no fucking way both of these are supposed to be how it works. One or the other is incorrect because they both involve the exact same mechanic but behave different depending on what you had equipped first.

IMO the second is how it's supposed to work AND that is how it works currently. It's only broken if you start with the drum as shown above. I understand that if you pulse Selos once with a drum it uses the mod until the song is recast. I'm talking about leaving the song running without a drum does not update the modifier to singing.

Sorry if I sound condescending, I'm just trying to clarify the issue because I understand it's difficult to understand what exactly is meant.

If you want to test this for yourself just start a song with an instrument equipped, leave the song running, and unequip your instrument. It can be DoTs, Selos, whatever you want. It will continue to use the instrument mod as long as you don't restart the song.

[Arrisard]

I'm gonna come back to this after dinner, bug forum isn't the place for it.

[Arrisard]

Originally Posted by hotstud [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

THIS DOES NOT INVOLVE TWISTING INSTRUMENTS, IT INVOLVES LEAVING A SINGLE SONG RUNNING PASSIVELY WHILE CHANGING INSTRUMENTS.

I know. How do I know? This means the same thing as this:

"Have the instrument equipped on initial cast completion = mod will last full duration of the spell no matter what you have equipped or switch to another song. This will continue on passively, as well."

I do not understand how you can think what you and I both said do not mean the very same thing.

*********

Originally Posted by hotstud [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Start Selos...
Equip drum.
You run faster. + mod
Unequip drum.
You run faster. + mod

I know, because these words mean the same thing:

Instrument equipped when song FINISHES INITIAL CASTING (not when you start casting, not when the song first ticks - the only thing that matters is when the instant when the casting bar timer runs out. If you miss that moment, the below situation applies in the next paragraph) = full mod forever more, until you stop singing that song for whatever reason. However, even if you stop casting and sing something else, the 2nd and 3rd ticks will still carry the full mod until the song runs out.

*********

Originally Posted by hotstud [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Start Selos...
No drum.
You run faster. - mod
Equip drum.
You run faster. + mod
Unequip drum.
You run faster. - mod

I know, because these words mean the same thing:

If no mod is equipped when the song FINISHES IT'S INITIAL CASTING = mods will only check on active ticks for that tick.

*********

Originally Posted by hotstud [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

When the song is recast passively it doesn't update the modifier.

I know, and that is not how it should be working but currently is. I have been saying that: "Mod should be checked when cast, not the remaining pulses unless otherwise recast actively or passively."

That is literally the same thing what Uthgaard said:

Originally Posted by Uthgaard [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It should only perform a new check on your modifiers if you persistently cast it (leaving a song on, effectively casting it again, refreshing the duration). Not for the passively remaining ticks of a song already cast.

This is what I've been saying. It should not check every pulse, only when cast/recast. If it checked every pulse, it would eliminate the viability of juggling entirely.

*********

Those are not the problem, this is:

Originally Posted by hotstud [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

THIS DOES NOT INVOLVE TWISTING INSTRUMENTS

That would be true, if you had not originally stated:

Originally Posted by hotstud [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Every pulse of a song is supposed to check your currently equipped modifier.

If the song checked for an in-hand mod every tick after you STOPPED passively recasting, then it most certainly does affect instrument juggling.

A song is cast when you click the gem and you get the spell bar for 3 seconds and it finishes. And then the song is passively recast every 6 seconds thereafter if left untouched (soandso's feet begin to move faster, or whatever). These casts should have a mod check.

If you stop casting, the remaining 3-4 ticks the song buff should not be checked since they are not being actively cast or passively recast, it is simply the song running it's course until it wears off. Because cast= check, pulse=no check. Pulses and passive recasts serve on the same server tick but they are not the same thing. If there was a check every pulse, there would be no juggling. I'd call that affecting juggling.

[Uthgaard]

To clarify
This is broken

Start Selos...
Equip drum.
You run faster. + mod
Unequip drum.
You run faster. + mod

This is not

Start Selos...
No drum.
You run faster. - mod
Equip drum.
You run faster. + mod
Unequip drum.
You run faster. - mod

Whether you manually click the button again or leave it to refresh itself, that is an identical form of recasting. A song already ticking away at its 3 ticks does not give a shit if you changed your equipment. A song refreshing its duration does.

[Arrisard]

Originally Posted by Uthgaard [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

A song already ticking away at its 3 ticks does not give a shit if you changed your equipment. A song refreshing its duration does.

^

if it did care, juggling would have no point.

[Uthgaard]

How you feel about it, including your inability or unwillingness to comprehend the topic, has little bearing on its accuracy.

[Arrisard]

I was agreeing with you. I haven't not agreed with anything you have said so far. The only time a song should check it's mod is when it is cast, actively or passively.