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Old 08-14-2023, 01:28 PM
FatMice FatMice is offline
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Thanks again Ennewi for finding all of this seemingly conclusive evidence that bard agro was one of the classes strong suites from classic to velious. my hope is that the nerd gets adjusted. pras
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Old 08-23-2023, 07:39 PM
Ennewi Ennewi is offline
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Default WTB aLovingRobot Lawrence Poe interview

https://dbsanfte.github.io/eq-archiv...tml/25522.html

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Message ID: 25522
Date: Thu Oct 25 16:41:44 BST 2001
Author: Daniel Sniderman
Subject: From my Guild's board Forum


Actually Slyde, I spoke to Lawrence Poe at the Fan Faire and his reason for
not having any of the new bard songs or 'disciplines' in the SPDAT and
related files was something along the lines of,

"Bard songs are harder to code and generally take alot more internal
balancing
before they are released to test. I wish I had something to put in
the SPDAT so you gyuys could look at it, but right now I don't. Sorry."

Actually, that's VERY close to what he said in regards t new bard
songs/disciplines. He's a super nice guy. Bit soft spoken though.

Additionally, I spoke with him about the problems with Selos and Drums of
the Beast. Oddly enough, he was unaware of the wrap-around problem with our
speed and wrote it down.

Overall, great guy. He took alot of notes too.

https://web.archive.org/web/20020210...leid=685705173

Quote:
02/05/2002 05:20 PM CST
Quoth the Caster, "Nevermore!"
The Verant employee who impressed us the most at the Minneapolis FanFaire was, without question, Lawrence Poe. This guy was cool, smart, and obviously knew his job incredibly well. He could rattle off spell facts and answer player questions like it was second nature to him. He has been a great asset to caster classes in EverQuest.

The problem is, he's not EverQuest's spell guru anymore.

No, he hasn't left Verant. But according to Graffe's Wizard Compilation, he has moved on to another project:

It turns out that he will still be working for Verant on an unannounced project doing gameplay systems and mechanics. He seems to be really happy and excited. (before the e-mails start: yes, I asked him about the unannounced project and he didn't share any info.)

https://www.linkedin.com/in/lawrencepoe

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Lawrence Poe

...

Game Designer
Sony Online Entertainment
2000 - 2003

Which explains the eventual decision to...

https://web.archive.org/web/20050119...ID=46680#47516

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Steppy is not online. Last active: 1/18/2005 8:03:48 PM Steppy
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Re: BoC.....-does- it work for us?
Posted: Jun 17 04 5:15 PM
The devs have said that they did not code specific effects as bard effects for purposes of hate generation. ALL effects cast by a bard, song, proc, right-click or whatever

have reduced agro simply because of the class we are -- this was the easy way to code it and it is no surprise Sony took that way out. I think this came up about two or

three Fan Faires ago
when a dev admitted they took the easy way out on bard agro coding.
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Old 09-05-2023, 10:46 AM
Ennewi Ennewi is offline
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https://web.archive.org/web/20030927...icID=108.topic

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Yurtrus Dywrnach
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Posts: 310
(4/11/01 1:38 am)
Reply Re: Bard equip question...
Why do you want a proc? Hell my bard gets enough agro just singing and whacking the mob at 20th lvl.

if you really feel the need for a proc might I suggest a pair of Obsidian shards? 6/23 with a 30 point proc which begins at 18th level I believe. Shards are rare but go for 250-300pp and can be camped by a group of people in there 20's good exp in sola.

Yurt
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HadrienLNS
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(4/23/01 8:48 pm)
Reply Ouch, Proc BAD! <sweeping arm motion>
I swore off procing weapons as a bard a LONG time ago. It's like adding a new garish color to your already luminous "Beat the Hell out of ME" sign. You are gonna find that monsters like you enough as is. If yer weapon is gonna proc something, make it a DoT or a buff. PGTs are pretty cool, since your Dex is likely to be high and your hitpoints low. 300dmg absorption at your level rocks. I've almost thought about buying one myself sometimes.

Bards don't hit things very well. Too many bards don't realize this. I honestly can't imagine why so many bards insist on it. If you played a Cleric, you'd have a big ass mace, but how many of them do you see bashing heads in? Remember, just because you CAN use something, doesn't mean you SHOULD. Instead of blowing 5K on a Sionachies Partisan(or whatever), save up and buy some better armor, or a magical instrument.

It actually amazes me that Bard weapons still sell for as much as they do. I guess they all go to twinkers who will shelve their bards in 2 months (so THAT'S where all the SS BPs are, lol).

https://web.archive.org/web/20020826...art=41&stop=60

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Aaoogaa
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(7/29/02 5:19:30 pm)
Reply Re: RE:
I have grouped with bards and I have never seen a better class when played correctly. Karnors WL room. 58 level bard was main tank, crowd control, healer, and puller. It was almost comical at the ease the bard had control of the room.

I have seen bards kiting 20 mobs effectivly.

Everyone wants a bard in an AE group. If ya don't your sorta silly.

Its true you only need one or two bards on a raid, but then how many shamen do you need on a raid?

I have played a bard and enjoyed my time as one but the class is just not for me. I know many bards out there that LOVE their class and its abilities. To many people play bards bad or without combining their abilities (this includes me [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] ). I think I have only met 2 people that actually play the class to its full potential.
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Old 11-11-2023, 12:23 PM
Sonolin Sonolin is offline
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Thanks for compiling all this evidence. I don't play a bard but wish you luck in getting this fixed.
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Old 11-25-2023, 12:22 PM
Ennewi Ennewi is offline
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Originally Posted by Sonolin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Thanks for compiling all this evidence. I don't play a bard but wish you luck in getting this fixed.

[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]


https://web.archive.org/web/20040904...id=1178&page=2

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Re: Question for the Devs
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Archimede999
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So I guess this thread has slightly degenerated. It's as I explained above, there are two camps. People who agree that there was
a significant change in the aggro generated by our chants, and people who don't think bards should get aggro.

I do not care whether or not people think bards should be able to tank.

All I want to know, is very very simple.

Is it a bug,


or

Is it a nerf.



very very simple. It's been over a month now.

'Stuce
08-31-2004 09:15 AM
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Re: Question for the Devs
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xanti
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If you go back in Time, about 2 Months, you'll see bards that can hold aggro in Kitegroups. Thats the only thing we want back.
09-02-2004 02:46 AM
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Old 11-28-2023, 05:54 PM
Ennewi Ennewi is offline
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https://web.archive.org/web/20011230...ML/007619.html

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Gello
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posted 12-17-2001 10:51 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Gello Click Here to Email Gello Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
Mistmoore yard, kurns tower, sarnak fort in LoIO, maybe paludal. Try having the bard sing lullaby during the ae. That's a pretty big taunt and has a side effect of "kinda" being an ae mez. (Tho very resistable) I forget what level bards get the ae slow but that's a decent taunt too and has an obvious use in ae. (It's high 20's I think) You want the plate-wearing bard tanking everything so you're free to heal the bard and the casters should they get aggro. Mage rain spells I understand don't generate a lot of aggro. Wizard will likely be the one you have the most trouble keeping alive. But being proactive and getting the bard to keep aggro can assure some decent pulls.
Don't listen to the people saying a group can't ae without an enchanter. It's a low 20's group for crying out loud. :P Even then, we were ae'ing in the grey before the nerf with just me (60 cleric) and a 57 wizard as the only two in the group who could cast an ae spell. Just test the waters a bit and you'll be fine. My nec has done ae in crystal caverns and cazic without an enchanter before. Granted, an enchanter will let you double the size of the pulls but it's still doable.

When your ae group gets to upper 20's, 29 for wizards, hit cazic courtyard. Great ae spot. You'd think paw would be great too, but the levels there vary too much and the number of casters make it tough to gather all the mobs together before your group has taken a serious beating. Once you get to 34, especially ae'ers, hit crystal caverns.
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Candail Delour
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posted 12-20-2001 02:23 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Candail Delour Click Here to Email Candail Delour Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
can kite them, heh. make sure everyone has sow or whatever and take turns aoe nuking.
or, since you have a bard, can have him/her mez them for a minuit or so to accumulate aggro then kite them with selo while everyone aoe nukes. i leveled my wizard alot doing this with a bard and a mage in lake of ill omen through the 20's. also leveled my bard through the 20's this way.
[This message has been edited by Candail Delour (edited 12-20-2001).]

https://dbsanfte.github.io/eq-archiv...-msg-90795.txt

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"James Grahame" <jamesgrahame@shaw.ca> wrote:

> Like it mattered whether he was or not. My guild took him down with a
>bard tanking and three Manaburn wizards
, just for kicks. It'll be
>interesting to see if Manaburn ever gets the 100 K limit applied to it or
>not like the Banes have.

If I had to guess I'd say Verant is going to add a flag to certain mobs
about whether or not manaburn affects them or to what degree. Right now
a group of 4-5 wizards can solo a 32k dragon. Even less if they happen
to crit on a manaburn. I wouldn't be surprised to see it have a limit of
something like 2k on certain mobs in the near future. While probably
being fairly balanced againt Luclin ubers or even ToV dragons, it's a
bit overpowering against pre-Velious ubers.

https://web.archive.org/web/20021119...picID=20.topic

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Turraslo
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Posts: 26
(3/1/02 8:36:17 pm)
Reply AOE Groups
I was talking to my friend irl and she said her dad and his guildies were using a strategy that surprisingly I have never heard of. It was called an AOE group and the basic gist of it is as follows....
I) Group- you need 2 enchanters 1 bard 1 cleric (w/ res stick preferably [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] ) and 2 wizards. i suppose any type of char that can AOE nuke is good but wizzies=best. (keep in mind thats AOE not AE and there is a difference. AE is what druids and wizzies use in quad kitting AOE is the equivalent of upheaval where it goes out from you...)
II) Starting- You have the bard run around the zone w/ an aggro song on. don't worry about too many you want as many as you can get...the way she described it they had 47 guys one time! (and this is at lvl 59) he pulls basically all the mobs in the zone w/i reason [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] and then you have the enchanters AOE stun...when that happens the nukers go to work nuke nuke etc. cleric keeps em healed and if the enchanters do their job no one dies.
III) Finishing- As you can tell this would bring AWESOME exp and i know it works cuz he punched through lvls 58 59 and 60 in a matter of 2 weeks....AND you get more loot this way too so it's also pretty lucrative

i didn't believe this could be done till i saw it w/ my own eyes and it almost made me wanna start a wizard...it certainly however made my jaw drop [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Turr
(47 guys!!)
Edited by: Turraslo at: 3/1/02 8:36:46 pm

https://web.archive.org/web/20020627....shtml?id=7381

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Mini ring of Fire Reply... By: Galathor,
2 posts
Posted @ Thu, May 9th 9:12 PM 2002 Score: Decent[3.00]
Ok you have 1 person stand on the platform and he is rooted. You then kill the spawns before they reach the platform, we had a bard ae dding to get agro, and you keep on killing until the named pops, during this time the room will pop probably 5 times, it seemed to be on a 6 minute timer, and pop speeds for the skeletons involved in the quest will increase as the battle goes on, the lvls of the pops will also increase. Btw if you knock a pop into the wall it despawns it it didn't seem to interupt the quest so if you don't want to worry about killing just keep knocking them into the wall until the named comes. After 30 min of killing (i was in the exp group and got a blue)the grimling high priest transforms into the named mob a 63. At this point things became chaotic for us we only had 2 groups of 50 to 60's and some pets were out that screwed up mezzes so by the time i got the adds mezzed half the raid was down including the MT and we only had 1 cleric to begin with. So the ST started killing when the mob was at 75%, we had a 60 necro, 59 dru, 60 cleric, 56 war, 56 bard, and i was the 56 ench keeping the adds mezzed. We were able to kill it, the war was dead, but the bard tanked it from 5 percent, and it dropped a 8int 35mana 35hp hat. I know others on the server have killed it and gotten 60 luclin spells so we are going to do it until we get a few. Hope that helps.

https://web.archive.org/web/20031024...topic&index=20

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Enklum
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Posts: 114
(8/12/03 5:55 am)
Reply
Re: Before I waste AA points...
Concerning aggro, a good drum and 4 stacking DoTs is usualy the solution ;-)

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Larraque Meleagrance
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(8/12/03 9:03 am)
Reply Re: Before I waste AA points...
Quote:
Concerning aggro, a good drum and 4 stacking DoTs is usualy the solution ;-)


Better off using 3 dots, and largo's absonant binding, if you need to be a bard tank. (Largo's is the level 51 slow movement, AC reduction, snare song)

Not that I ever bard tank.

But I'd think using a Battle Drummer's Main Gauche (or Singing Short Sword, obviously) would be better than all but the best of drums (Thunderous of Karana). The ratio is 1.8 (same as the singing short sword), and it does 8 less damage per 10 seconds per dot than my Draconic Fellowship Drum. And if I'm in hand to hand, the damage done by the main gauche is better than the damage done by my fists by at least 30. And I'm sure it does more aggro.
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Last edited by Ennewi; 11-28-2023 at 06:02 PM..
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Old 11-30-2023, 09:25 PM
Zuranthium Zuranthium is offline
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What exactly are you arguing Bard aggro should be? Do you have any kind of goal in mind, and for each specific type of song?
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Old 11-30-2023, 10:25 PM
Rygar Rygar is offline
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Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
What exactly are you arguing Bard aggro should be? Do you have any kind of goal in mind, and for each specific type of song?
For now I think it is fairly obvious to just reverse the cap they put on bard song aggro the last patch or 2 ago, as it is proven beyond a reasonable doubt to be a 2004+ change far out of era.
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Old 12-02-2023, 12:31 AM
long.liam long.liam is offline
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Originally Posted by Rygar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
For now I think it is fairly obvious to just reverse the cap they put on bard song aggro the last patch or 2 ago, as it is proven beyond a reasonable doubt to be a 2004+ change far out of era.
Do you have any official EQ patch notes as evidence that bard aggro was changed post 2004? Otherwise this entire thread is just a bunch of random nonsense pulled from the dark web that can filed under inconclusive.
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Old 12-02-2023, 01:20 AM
Ennewi Ennewi is offline
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Originally Posted by long.liam [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Do you have any official EQ patch notes as evidence that bard aggro was changed post 2004? Otherwise this entire thread is just a bunch of random nonsense pulled from the dark web that can filed under inconclusive.
Always the same comments from you. It's getting old, as is this thread. Last post from here on out. Anyone else wants to contribute something worth reading, go for it.
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