Soulbinders?

[Kika Maslyaka]

its a wrong kind of balance

when warrior tanks, cleric heals, and wizard nukes - thats balance

when half of the classes cannot change their bind location wihout help of the other half - thats just stupid

its one kind of thing to be dependant on others to defeat an ancounter, its complitely different thing, when you don't have the same freedom of moving around like some of others (not talking about faction)

convient abilities should not be be balanced vs combat abilities

[falkun]

Originally Posted by Kika Maslyaka [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

convient abilities should not be be balanced vs combat abilities

I had a post in one of the recent newbie forums about how recent MMO's "fixed" problems like this. Verant/Sony made the classes this way, from the roots of D&D, to ensure social interaction between players in and out of combat. Whether you view it as another chance to interact with others or as an inconvenience to your mobility, if you can't bind you will be forced to interact with other players to obtain a bind (yay socializing), and if you can bind, unless you're an asshole, you will offer more than your fair share of binds to those who cannot (altruism is also good).

Finally, you aren't required to bind anywhere, you could go through your whole leveling experience without dieing by being super careful. But knowing where your bound in relation to where you will leave your body will make you appreciate living through fights that much more (death having a real penalty is also a good thing).

TL : DR - Social interaction is good, in any way, shape or form. IMO, don't do anything to decrease it.

[Kika Maslyaka]

except original DnD wasn't a mmo
It was played in a close group session when your party was around you most of the time. And you didn't really needed to go and LOOK for a bind... Players certainly were not "logging into a game" at odd hours to play solo...

the social aspect should be based on fighting together, doing raids thats cannot be posibly be done wihout right class distribution, not looking for a bind for 45 min

[falkun]

Originally Posted by Kika Maslyaka [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

except original DnD wasn't a mmo
It was played in a close group session when your party was around you most of the time. And you didn't really needed to go and LOOK for a bind... Players certainly were not "logging into a game" at odd hours to play solo...

So you are saying melees (non-binders) are logging in at odd hours to play solo? How many melee do you know that solo often/efficiently? The players that do engage in this activity know the risks they are taking, its not like its a new game.

You are providing a minority case to support a change that will affect the majority of the playerbase in a negative fashion.

[Kika Maslyaka]

Originally Posted by falkun [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So you are saying melees (non-binders) are logging in at odd hours to play solo? How many melee do you know that solo often/efficiently? The players that do engage in this activity know the risks they are taking, its not like its a new game.

You are providing a minority case to support a change that will affect the majority of the playerbase in a negative fashion.

oh yeah I am perfectly fine with taking risks and trying to solo as a melee.
Nothing wrong with that.
Not beeing able to travel between cities AT ALL wihout outside help is ridiculus

[Kika Maslyaka]

fine i will give another exmaple:

there is a raid in progress to kill say Nagafen
all your casters sitting by his lair waiting for melees to arrive
All of your melees are some how bound in Oggok (say after recent fear raid)
And you don't have any druids or wizards.
So your melees get togther, run across feerrot, Inothule, south ro, oasis, north ro, zone in FP and start looking for a bind... For 15 min... for 30 min...for 45 min...
Eventualy the casters decide to send someone to FP to bind the melees...
And while you doing that another guild showed up, and killed Nagafen
Great raiding day.

[falkun]

Originally Posted by Kika Maslyaka [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

fine i will give another exmaple:

there is a raid in progress to kill say Nagafen
all your casters sitting by his lair waiting for melees to arrive
All of your melees are some how bound in Oggok (say after recent fear raid)
And you don't have any druids or wizards.
So your melees get togther, run across feerrot, Inothule, south ro, oasis, north ro, zone in FP and start looking for a bind... For 15 min... for 30 min...for 45 min...
Eventualy the casters decide to send someone to FP to bind the melees...
And while you doing that naother guild showed up, and killed Nagafen
Great raiding day.

The other guild was better organized. You are the idiot guild/raid leader that let all your casters sit around with their thumbs up their asses while your melees looked for binds. You want something to happen, make it happen. Send your casters to bind your melees. Or just have your melees not bind and don't wipe. If you are mobilizing first and you fail to get the raid target, then that's your fault, not the game's.

Again, your example is a minority case where your refusal to put forth effort or accept greater risk resulted in your loss.

Originally Posted by Kika Maslyaka [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

oh yeah I am perfectly fine with taking risks and trying to solo as a melee.
Nothing wrong with that.
Not beeing able to travel between cities AT ALL wihout outside help is ridiculus

What is stopping you from traveling between cities? I fail to see how I cannot remain bound in Ak`anon while I run to Paineel. Do I die from being too far from my bind spot? Is there a 3-zone leash that I can't be further than my bind spot from?

[RiffDaemon]

Originally Posted by falkun [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The other guild was better organized. You are the idiot guild/raid leader that let all your casters sit around with their thumbs up their asses while your melees looked for binds. You want something to happen, make it happen. Send your casters to bind your melees. Or just have your melees not bind and don't wipe. If you are mobilizing first and you fail to get the raid target, then that's your fault, not the game's.

Again, your example is a minority case where your refusal to put forth effort or accept greater risk resulted in your loss.

This. All of this. And then some

[stormlord]

Blaming people because they get bored? Blaming htem because they get discouraged having to run across the continent to bind a friend? Blaming them because they were unable to find a binder in the past 25 minutes, lacked patience and roamed around and got killed? There's a lot of blame going on and not much sympathy. Why? That bothers me. Maybe you haven't experienced the darker side of p1999, but it's there.

I guess the issue is this: we're humans. Humans have lives and they're known for making mistakes and mindless errors. So the game punishes them when they make these said mistakes. It's like punching a man in the gut because he breathes. See, the problem is they will always make these mistakes. Always. Some of the mistakes will be corrected and not repeated, but the vast majority of them that're relevant in this discussion will remain, time after time, in different forms. I think the advent of modern gaming has come to the conclusion that punishing evil is appropriate, but punishing mistakes isn't. Give players every opportunity to learn, only appearing every so often when your presence is required. Leave the rest to the players.

This is aside from the issue that basing a travel system on population or any kind of exclusivity is like inviting a serial killer into your home. But anyway, I know full well what hte rules are at project 1999 and do not expect them to chagne simply becuase I disagree. If I disagree I can go elsewhere or even make my own server (given the means and talent were actually there). I don't even feel passionate or angry about this.

I do not want to come here and throw insult after injury on EQ. I love this game. I loved 1999-01. Having to bind, not having maps for the zone, being thrown down and having my face shoved in the mud, I've enjoyed these things. Sometimes I like it rough. Over the years I've shared in my enjoyment of these things with others. I'm not making this up. It's the honest truth what I say here. And I'd be very sad if there was no game left on earth where you were treated like a disrespecting noob punk on monday morning - badly and indifferently.

But if someone presses me I'll be honest about something.

[falkun]

Originally Posted by stormlord [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Blaming people because they get bored? Blaming htem because they have to run across the continent to bind a friend? Blaming them because they were unable to find a binder in the past 25 minutes, lacked patience and roamed around and got killed? There's a lot of blame going on and not much sympathy. Why? That bothers me. Maybe you haven't experienced the darker side of p1999, but it's there.

I know its there, but thats because your apathy lets it get there. Forcing interaction is what keeps EQ from turning into the anonymous bitchfest that WoW instances turned into. When you had to find a group on your server for instances in WoW, reputations mattered and people knew your name. Now, with the dungeon finder, people wipe on the first boss and ragequit. Which experience do you want EQ to follow?

I'm not blaming anyone, I'm telling people to accept responsibility for their own actions. If you mobilize to a raid target first and don't get the kill, how can you possibly blame someone other than yourself (assuming all PVE rules of engagement are adhered to)?

Originally Posted by stormlord [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I guess the issue is this: we're humans. Humans have lives and they're known for making mistakes and mindless errors. So the game punishes them when they make these said mistakes. It's like punching a man in the gut because he breathes. See, the problem is they will always make these mistakes. Always. Some of the mistakes will be corrected and not repeated, but the vast majority of them that're relevant in this discussion will remain, time after time, in different forms. I think the advent of modern gaming has come to the conclusion that punishing evil is appropriate, but punishing mistakes isn't. Give players every opportunity to learn, only appearing every so often when your presence is required. Leave the rest to the players.

No, this game does not punish you for breathing. You are supposed to breath, just like you are supposed to interact with others for binds. You are supposed to breath, just like you are supposed to assist your MT. If you are not doing what you are supposed to, like taking unnecessary risk by soloing as most melees, then you are bucking the system and you better be prepared for that punch. Your analogy doesn't compare.

That's the other problem, modern games DON'T punish evil game practices. If you die in a modern game, how long does it take you to get back to killing? <5min. In EQ, if you die you could very well be spending multiple hours getting back to killing. Guess which game you feel more rewarded in? Guess which game teaches players to the point of intuition about game mechanics? 9 out of 10 players would say EQ.

If you fight appropriate monsters in Everquest in the appropriate setting, you won't be making mistakes and won't need outside intervention. If you aren't doing that, then its your own damn fault and you won't get outside intervention. Stop trying to place blame on anyone other than YOURSELF for YOUR decisions.

Originally Posted by stormlord [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This is aside from the issue that basing a travel system on population or any kind of exclusivity is like inviting a serial killer into your home. But anyway, I know full well what hte rules are at project 1999 and do not expect them to chagne simply becuase I disagree. If I disagree I can go elsewhere or even make my own server (given the means and talent were actually there). I don't even feel passionate or angry about this.

If I knowingly invite a serial killer into my home, I can probably expect to die. If I base a travel system on population, I can expect to have difficulty in travel.

^^That's your comparison? Ok. Going from that...If I am polite to the serial killer and ask nicely, he may not kill me. If I ask other players nicely to assist with travel, they may help me. If they refuse to help me or the serial murder still decides to try to kill me, I am still capable of fending for myself: either hoofing it on foot or defending myself against a murderer. Either way, my fate in both instances is ENTIRELY in my control, from the time I let the murder into my house until either I or he is dead. Stop trying to blame "the system" for your mistakes in judgment or ability.

Originally Posted by stormlord [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I do not want to come here and throw insult after injury on EQ. I love this game. I loved 1999-01. Having to bind, not having maps for the zone, being thrown down and having my face shoved in the mud, I've enjoyed these things. Sometimes I like it rough. Over the years I've shared in my enjoyment of these things with others. I'm not making this up. It's the honest truth what I say here. And I'd be very sad if there was no game left on earth where you were treated like a noob punk on monday morning.

This is how this game treats you, and you know what, you will become a better player because of it. You appreciate the miracles in group survival, you understand aggro range, etc. You want to feel rewarded for something, work for it. You don't feel rewarded for being handed something on a silver platter.