Jboots camp isn't classic

[loramin]

Originally Posted by zillabunny [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Again this has nothing to do with mana stone, I never camped mana stone and don't know the details but I did camp the jboots in classic and know they dropped pretty often...

Also I dunno why you're discussing 90's comics this makes no sense, this is a game that is supposed to be fun, not some speculative market where things have actual value.

I actually really loved MBlake's post: he seemed to go off on a tangent ... and according to this forum's culture it'd be perfectly ok if that was it; this place loves tangents.

But he did something unusual and clever and actually tied the tangent back to the main thread (and I completely disagree with you: obviously comics and mana orbs aren't the same, but they are both speculatively traded items and the comparison was relevant).

But Zila, back to the original topic OF COURSE it's not classic. In classic times like X% of the server knew about JBoots. Here X * 500% (I'm good at math) know about it.

But mechanically, /list is pretty damn close to how GMs would have handled it back then IF that many people did know and fight over JBoots ... well, modulo the "never sleeping GM" it represents (which is why I started that other thread about how /list shouldn't let people queue up past a certain point, and should require rolls after that ... because according to the GM guidelines, that's essentially how the Verant staff would have handled it ... and Verant GMs slept [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]).

[Puluin]

From my vague memory I do not recall manastone or j boots being a highly sought item until AFTER they removed the drops and changed j boots to quest.

These items dropped so frequently they were considered common items that took only a kill or two to see a drop from starting camp.

It wasn't until after they stopped dropping that people started coveting them.

In the beginning they were such common drops no one had the mind set of "oh, I HAVE to get that item NOW before it disappears."

I remember full 6 member groups getting jboots for everyone in one evening session.

Quite similar to how frequently dire wolf hide cloak drops off the guy in kael (coffee/memory fail).

[aspomwell]

Originally Posted by Puluin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

From my vague memory I do not recall manastone or j boots being a highly sought item until AFTER they removed the drops and changed j boots to quest.

These items dropped so frequently they were considered common items that took only a kill or two to see a drop from starting camp.

It wasn't until after they stopped dropping that people started coveting them.

In the beginning they were such common drops no one had the mind set of "oh, I HAVE to get that item NOW before it disappears."

I remember full 6 member groups getting jboots for everyone in one evening session.

Quite similar to how frequently dire wolf hide cloak drops off the guy in kael (coffee/memory fail).

Not my recollection. If you checked out any of the forums (and I assume you did back then, as you are here now) then it was widely known that Drelzna was dropping a note instead of the jboots on test and that things on test flowed through to live.

This caused a flood of people (me included) to head to Najena and camp them. I got mine about a week before they removed them in game. I was 6th in 'line' when I arrived and it took 13 hours for me to get mine. (edit: this was on Tunare)

I never cared for manastone (necro, so pretty good mana regen, could have used one I guess) or guise (already a dark elf) but the jboots and COS were my epic items. My family commitments keep me from spending more than 2 hours online now so even on green I'd never get them so I'm content dicking around on blue!

[Meiva]

My wait was 19 hours, and I started list at #3. The poor bloke next in line waited 20 hours AT #1!!! Not including the time he waited in other positions lol.

No idea if shits classic, but it's pretty brutal.

[Erati]

Originally Posted by Meiva [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

My wait was 19 hours, and I started list at #3. The poor bloke next in line waited 20 hours AT #1!!! Not including the time he waited in other positions lol.

No idea if shits classic, but it's pretty brutal.

holy crap 20 hours for no boot drops? How many empty Drel's? yikes.

[PointMade]

From: 7/6/99 (Source)

Title: A RANT on JBoots and Camping in general (VERY LONG)

. . . .

You know what the problem is Brad? Journeyman boots are an _ESSENTIAL ITEM_ for
every class but Shamans, Druids, and Rangers, and they're pretty damn useful
even for them.

The Drelzna spot has a chance to spawn every twenty minutes or so. Drelzna
generally pops up about three out of five times. No problem, right?

Drelzna drops MAYBE three to four Journeyman boots per day. Now THAT is a
problem.

In your infinite wisdom, for the love of Tunare, PLEASE explain to me why a _NO
DROP_ item like JBoots that is _absolutely essential_ for almost every class
should be so ridiculously rare. Actually, please explain why ANY "no drop" item
should be THAT rare. It's absolutely IMPOSSIBLE to "farm" Journeyman Boots,
since they're no drop. It just can't be done. It takes a group of 25's to take
Drelzna and there are about 100 monsters on the way to her, so it's
ridiculously difficult to twink a low-level character with JBoots.

Do you have ANY idea how upset people get in Najena? People /shout curses every
time Drelzna spawns with another earring of disease reflection on her.
Killstealing is RIDICULOUS in Najena... I've seen upwards of fifty people
packed into Drelzna's little room, three entire guilds, just to see who can
nuke her the quickest.

As a melee character, I've taken my lvl 35 Ranger into Najena and camped
literally from nine o'clock at night to SEVEN IN THE MORNING for boots. Most of
the time, a lvl 25 Wizard pops up with his weak little group (who could just
barely handle her and her cadre of necromancers), nukes her, and gets the kill.
And of course there's nothing I can do except leave.

Tempers flare, enemies are made, roleplaying is abandoned, FUN is abandoned.
I've never seen people so... so.... NASTY as they are in Najena. Rubicite
doesn't even compare.

Now, lets go back to the "problem" that you guys are thinking so hard on...
high level characters camping low level monsters. Let me ask you a question. Do
you honestly believe that I'd be in Najena killing greens camping the Flowing
Black Robe at level thirty-five if I could possibly avoid it? Holy CHRIST I
hate Najena! When I finally left, I had camped there for twenty hours straight
and I could barely see clearly through the blood in my eyes, I was so pissed
off. You have NO idea.

Tell me Brad, with your character that you play in the game, are you around
level 25 yet? If not, when you get there, what will you do? I know you play a
Ranger, but let's say you're a Warrior or a Rogue... will you give up on
Journeyman boots or will you waste a week of your life for one essential item?
Will you just give up on an essential item for your class or will you depend on
shamans and druids for SoW for the rest of your character's life? I really want
to know. Don't answer as the game designer, answer as a player.

Camping IS a huge problem. Fifteen levels ago I wouldn't have believed it, but
as a Ranger I _require_ a full set of Rubicite armor... because there ain't no
decent chain in the game and I can't tank without it.

Speaking of Rubicite, it has the exact same problem to a much lesser extent.
You see, at the levels where you need rubicite, the monsters are mostly blue...
so you're gaining experience and actually (gasp!) having fun. Still, I've been
in TR2 (the upper throne room in Cazic-Thule) for over sixteen hours at a
stretch with nary a sign of a rubicite helm. I know, I know, as a Ranger I
could also get a Crested Helm from castle mistmoore (which is better anyway),
and I _have_ tried for one, but apparently they're even MORE rare... nothing
like JBoots, but pretty damn rare.

. . .

[zillabunny]

Regardless of if their highly sought after or not, they're a fun item, that shouldn't be an ultra rare drop. there is no negative impact if more people have them, the server is more fun if they're at the normal drop rate.

[Danth]

I recall warning people about low drop rates on the legacy items back in August/September and I was largely brushed off. Maybe us folks who were around in 2009 know a thing or two, eh?

Danth

[zillabunny]

If they have a reason behind lowering the drop rates I'd love to hear it, I'm just saying it's not really classic to have to camp the jboots for this long a group could typically fill up in a night of fun gaming ...

Hell I'm even ok with the afk checks and everything else I just think the drop rate should be normal.

[Tiger_King]

Looks like all items that were placed on /list all had drop rates nerfed into the ground for personal admin/GM/server host reasons rather than adhering to classic drop rates. This is likely to try and induce the “rarity” belief rather than the realistic understanding...

Yes these items may have been viewed for some time during classic eras as “rare” but not due to actual drop rates but rather due to lack of the player/overall community knowledge.

So it looks like the server hosts would rather make a false look alike game rather than uphold the real drop rates and mechanisms of the drop as they were in classic. Very simple.

The unfortunate truth here is that ALL items will be more prevalent than classic because of the wide prevalence of knowledge about the game. So by the admins skewing the 4 list item drop rates was and remains stupid practice and was unrealistic to have done in the first place.