Plane of Mischief Questions...

[Seungkyu]

Originally Posted by Raije1000 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

i wonder who actually takes advice from loramin, a simple inspect of his mediocre shaman says it all

The guy has 5000+ posts, makes thoughtful commentaries, and does his best to be helpful.

10/10 Would take advice from Loramin.

[zodium]

no

[Nuggie]

Loramin has done more than most for the wiki, helps build the community.

+1 for Loramin... sure would be nice to have a post point system like the FoH forums. (Not a criticism Rogdog, just wistful wishing)

[Raije1000]

its one thing to talk about the game, its another to play the game

[fastboy21]

Originally Posted by Raije1000 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

its one thing to talk about the game, its another to play the game

It is one thing to go out of your way to be helpful to others, its another to be rude and disruptive.

I know which one I'd prefer the server had more of.

+1 for Loramin

[zodium]

Originally Posted by fastboy21 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It is one thing to go out of your way to be helpful to others, its another to be rude and disruptive.

I know which one I'd prefer the server had more of.

+1 for Loramin

giving advice that's trivially and often comically wrong isn't really that helpful tbh

[loramin]

Originally Posted by Seungkyu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The guy has 5000+ posts, makes thoughtful commentaries, and does his best to be helpful.

10/10 Would take advice from Loramin.

Originally Posted by Nuggie [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Loramin has done more than most for the wiki, helps build the community.

+1 for Loramin... sure would be nice to have a post point system like the FoH forums. (Not a criticism Rogdog, just wistful wishing)

Originally Posted by fastboy21 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It is one thing to go out of your way to be helpful to others, its another to be rude and disruptive.

I know which one I'd prefer the server had more of.

+1 for Loramin

[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Originally Posted by zodium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

giving advice that's trivially and often comically wrong isn't really that helpful tbh

Man, you are really bad at this subjective/objective stuff. Let's consider just one item, the chest piece, because it probably makes your case the strongest and it's been held up as an example in this discussion.

But first let me be clear, because when a person says something in one context, and someone else takes it out of context, that doesn't make the first person "wrong", it makes the second person an ass. I'm talking about having just one BP, the same as I was back on page 1. Obviously two BPs are better than one, and if you can have a stats BP and a clickie BP you get (almost all of) the benefits of both worlds.

AC: 20
STR: +5 STA: +7 WIS: +14 HP: +50 MANA: +80
SV FIRE: +9 SV MAGIC: +9 SV POISON: +9
Effect: Regrowth of the Grove (Any Slot/Can Equip, Casting Time: 9.0)

vs.

AC: 32
STR: +5 WIS: +15 INT: +15 HP: +50 MANA: +90
SV DISEASE: +15 SV MAGIC: +15 SV POISON: +15

Clearly stat-wise the PoM chest piece is better. You get a net +18 to resists, +12 to AC, +10 Mana, and +1 Wis, and you only lose -7 Sta. As I said, stat-wise the chest piece is one of the strongest upgrades ...

... and yet I still maintain that if you have to choose just one, the Skyshrine piece is better because of the click. If I could have only one BP for the rest of my life, I sincerely would choose the Skyshrine one.

I guarantee you will never notice +1 Wis, +10 Mana, or even +12 AC as a Druid (or rather, you'll notice them about as much as you'll notice the -7 Sta). You might notice the saves, in that you'll maybe get feared 1 out of 20 times less or so ...

... but you will definitely notice not having to go into your spell book to mem Regrowth of the Grove everytime someone wants it. You'll especially notice when that last person joins the group the moment after you just regrowth-ed everyone else (which, Murphy's Law, often happens), or when you're low on mana. But every single time you want to cast that spell and you don't have to waste time sitting down, paging to the right page, memming the spell, casting it, then sitting down again to remove it and replace it with another spell, you'll notice.

And of course, the 600 mana Regrowth the BP saves you each time is nothing to sneeze at. Assuming you recast every 20 minutes that's 30/mana a minute, or half a mana a second (ie. roughly the same amount as FT3). But really the time saved is an even bigger deal to me.

A few meaningless stats and 1 in 20 less times running feared vs. saving myself at least ten seconds of of meaningless effort every twenty minutes I play the game (and getting FT3 as long as I would have been casting it anyway?)

And remember, to lose all that isn't free: it will cost you over 100k in plat/PoM cards.

You're that certain that I'm objectively wrong about all that that you're ready to die on that hill?



P.S. In my opinion the case for PoM armor is actually much stronger on the pieces without clickies. Twisted Nature Gloves are objectively better than Woven Grass Gauntlets ... but as I said in the post that started this all, the differences between those two items are:

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

not as dramatic as the Enchanter robe or Shaman boots.

[loramin]

Originally Posted by zodium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

let me level with you: you don't have to choose just one.

So you're saying your entire argument that I'm "wrong" (and shouldn't be posting) ... the entire thing you've spent pages fighting over ... isn't even based on you having a legitimate disagreement with me?

Remember, the original context of this thread, before you entered, was talking about whether someone (an Enchanter, not even a Druid) should upgrade a single piece of SS armor to PoM armor, and whether it was worth the cost to do so. Then Baylan chimed in and mentioned the other classes, and in that context, I replied.

You claim I often write too much, and I probably do. There's multiple reasons, but here's a big one: my reply there wasn't long, and look where it got me? If I don't spell out every last detail in every post I write, assholes like you show up to argue with things I never said.

In the original context my quote made perfect sense. I never even disagreed with you, because I never said you had to choose just one or whether two BPs was better than one: I just assumed that the hypothetical person we were discussing was picking one, because the conversation hadn't specified that exact detail and we were just generally talking about which set was better.

Now look, in a text-based forum, without faces and tones of voice, people can make different assumptions about the conversation. I can completely understand how you might have seen the context differently. But you know, a normal/sane person would have said "do you really mean PoM is only a little better, because if you get it, but keep some Velious armor around for clickies you get the best of both worlds, and those stats are pretty clearly better?" If you had I would have agreed with you, and that would have been the end of it.

But instead you started this this giant fight over absolutely nothing ... and managed to RnF-up an otherwise perfectly normal Server Chat thread.

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

But first let me be clear, because when a person says something in one context, and someone else takes it out of context, that doesn't make the first person "wrong", it makes the second person an ass.

[Nuggie]

Is being "the most accurate" more important than giving someone a path to start down?

[zodium]

it's not important or good to send people down paths to nowhere