Ben Stein vs. Everquest

[karsten]

list of things I didn't read:

1.

Originally Posted by Pycoba_rng [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Though its very late and im intoxicated right now. I personally agree with a lot of the statements you have made. If we all just did what made us happy in the end. The world would be one chaotic place.
Just imagine how many more obese people would be in america? I have so many responsibilities that don't make me happy. In the end though I am much more happier with a sense of accomplishment having done them. Evolution is apparent. If you disagree with the fact that the younger generation is being brought up tremedously differntly you are a fool. It guys like Ben Stein we need. I'm no fan of Ben Stein , but comments like his have more of a positive effect then a neg one. We need people to push us into responsibilty aka productive things. We need people to encourage us and to point out time wasted. Back in the day when the diagnosis of ADD wasn't around. Parents would just discipline you harder. Instead we medicate society often way to much. As far as our education system being so low. You can thank the public school system/ polotics for this notion. Maybe if we got rid of the illegals attending these schools with no profound way on learning english maybe then we could concentrate on studies that matter for the children that are hear legally. Or maybe if parents just took the time and payed proper attention to their kids there may be more hope. Back in the day it was normal for the wife to stay home with the child. Now in days its demonized into a cultural norm that the wife has to work. The economy has now responded... double income parents.... It was much more plausible for one parent to work back then. Now its a lot harder. You can thank womans right groups, and the socialistic terror it has brought onto this nation. The day woman aren't demonized for staying home with the children, and the day the average male can support his family on his own. Is the day we might be able to focus on our kids/schools more. I hope more people like Ben Stein come out of this generation of kids. Its people with a driving force that gets things done in this world. Not people doing theings for their own happiness. But for the greater good of others and their hapiness. Think jesus perhaps?

[guineapig]

Some would argue that listening to celebrities is a waste of time.

I think Mr. Stein himself said that during the last election. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Ihealyou]

Originally Posted by fastboy21 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You'd rather enjoy life than do what you're supposed to do? Again, a dangerous cultural attitude that leads to mediocrity and ironically (in the end) unhappiness.

Hi Grandpa!

Success does bring happiness, which is why most people don't sit around all day watching TV and playing EQ. My point was that if you chase success at the expense of all else, you'll end up rich and skinny and everything else you're supposed to be, but unhappy. I was just trying to say that its ok to take some time to enjoy yourself without feeling guilty about it. Thanks for calling me lazy though! I better go take my Adderall because my parents didn't raise me right...

[Odeseus]

I dunno. I can see one side of the argument:

Playing video games is akin to wasting your time doing anything else. Obsessing over reality TV, facebook, whatever. There are better things to do with your free time.

On the flip side:

It is your free time. For me, during my free time I want to do as little as possible because the rest of my life is busy as hell. I rarely have more than a pair of hours at the end of the day in which I can just chill, and my chosen method of chilling is playing EQ and killing pixels. No different than anything else.

[Gandite]

Keep in mind that in everquest's heyday they had 450k subscriptions. That's 450,000 monthly payments of $15. All that money employs a lot of people so while people playing EQ are not producing, they are consuming. Consuming is a normal part of an economy.

Ben Stein claims to be an economist but he certainly doesn't know much about economics or finance. I'm an econ/finance major and while I do not proclaim to be brilliant in either field I honestly feel like Ben Stein knows absolutely nothing about either. If you'd like proof go look up what the mongoloid said about the global financial crisis. He's a loud-mouth moron which is why his only outlet to get people to listen to him is Fox News.

[fastboy21]

Originally Posted by Ihealyou [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Hi Grandpa!

Success does bring happiness, which is why most people don't sit around all day watching TV and playing EQ. My point was that if you chase success at the expense of all else, you'll end up rich and skinny and everything else you're supposed to be, but unhappy. I was just trying to say that its ok to take some time to enjoy yourself without feeling guilty about it. Thanks for calling me lazy though! I better go take my Adderall because my parents didn't raise me right...

i never called you lazy. i never said your parents didn't raise you right. i don't blame you, your parents, my parents, or anyone for the reality of our culture.

all i am pointing out is that our society is in a dangerous place because ALL of us (myself included) are living in a culture that tells us "do what makes you happy."

if you get defensive because you see yourself in the culture i'm describing it shouldn't bother you, unless you know you ought to be living your life differently. in either case, it makes no difference to me. enjoy your life playing EQ 24/7 or do something else...its your life, not mine. it isn't my place to say what is "best" for you in particular.

[Ihealyou]

Originally Posted by fastboy21 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

i never called you lazy. i never said your parents didn't raise you right. i don't blame you, your parents, my parents, or anyone for the reality of our culture.

all i am pointing out is that our society is in a dangerous place because ALL of us (myself included) are living in a culture that tells us "do what makes you happy."

if you get defensive because you see yourself in the culture i'm describing it shouldn't bother you, unless you know you ought to be living your life differently. in either case, it makes no difference to me. enjoy your life playing EQ 24/7 or do something else...its your life, not mine. it isn't my place to say what is "best" for you in particular.

Sorry if I got defensive when you quoted my post as an example of what's wrong with society...

I wouldn't be happy playing EQ all day. I like to learn. I like to be successful. Most people do. I'm not trying to say that you should sit on your ass all day playing video games. But who's to say that learning and working are a better use of time than pursuing happiness? When you're lying on your deathbed, you're not going to care about how much money you have, or how smart you are. You're going to be thinking about how happy you were. Money or intelligence can bring this happiness to some people, for others it doesn't. I don't see the existence of this latter group as a societal ill. Its a reality, and there's nothing wrong with accepting it.

[hedbonker]

Originally Posted by fastboy21 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

all i am pointing out is that our society is in a dangerous place because ALL of us (myself included) are living in a culture that tells us "do what makes you happy."

Yeah that whole "Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" bullshit has been fucking this country over for over 240 years.

Bear in mind that Ben Stein was Nixon's speechwriter. And he will defend that criminal to the death even today. Fuck him.

[soup]

Originally Posted by fastboy21 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

and this is the EXACT issue with an entire generation plus of americans (and arguably some other Western European countries) right now.

How is doing something you enjoy not productive? The answer to this should be obvious. That it requires any explanation at all to some gives an idea about how culturally deep the notion is.

Your happiness is more important than working, studying, improving your mind, having a successful career, being in good physical condition? Again, a good synopsis of a very dangerous cultural norm in our society.

You'd rather enjoy life than do what you're supposed to do? Again, a dangerous cultural attitude that leads to mediocrity and ironically (in the end) unhappiness.

There are a generation of young american adults already entering the work place that were raised in this culture. There is a couple generations of children behind them that are being raised with the same mentality.

I'm very hesitant to get on the "young people today have no sense of responsibility" band wagon as I think most generations have looked back in disgust at the young generations in their society, and everything has turned out fine.

I'm reminded of a quote on young people in society:

"The children today now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers."

Socrates said this around 400BC...so there seems to maybe be a prevailing habit of the older generation to criticize the younger...

To some degree, I still have faith in our children to be of the same exact fiber of our older generations who fought in WWII and sacrificed everything for their sense of responsibility to family and nation.

On the other hand, I do think there is a real cultural shift that has gone on...and that it is a cultural shift that if left unchecked would ultimately represent a threat to our society.

It sounds like you confuse the idea of doing what make you happy with the idea of mindless rampant gluttony. Most people don't interpret "Do what you love to do" as "Play EQ all day, shovel cheese burgers down your throat incessantly, and do lines of cocaine every 15 minutes."

I also find irony in mentioning WW2. While I have no problem calling that generation by it's common name of "The greatest generation", the irony comes from the fact that the war was basically started by people more concerned with collective productivity than individual happiness (and I'm not referring to the Allies here, if that isn't clear), which seems to be what you are advocating, the need to sacrifice personal happiness for collective productivity.

[Hobby]

I personally have wasted more time guiding and taking care of these players than i should...just thankful for the large amount of wonderful people I've had the chance to meet that, otherwise, i would never of known.

As much as a waste of time it is, I still feel like I am doing something good.