Vex Thal and Srra Temple + AA's

[StarLord]

Originally Posted by pasi [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I love Luclin, but it is a CSR nightmare. I can only imagine how terrible it would be with Project1999s lust for pixels. I'm of the opinion that Luclin CSR issues was the primary reason PoTime was quasi-instanced.

Most mobs are perma-rooted. Amazing for FTE disputes.

Shitty behavior from live:
Engaging Taskmasters (duoable) to FTE cursed cycle.
Griefing enemy guilds by standing in on Cursed AE.
6 manning Rhag1 to claim the cycle until you leave zone.
Blowing blood spawns with no intention of killing Emp.
Leapfrogging in Vex Thal, Sseru, and on the way to High Priest and XtC.

Luclin was a degenerate raid scene on live servers. I can only imagine how much worse it could get here.

You're not wrong but I'm not sure i see things being any better here. What i read above is "The same problems we have now will transfer to another expansion."

Mostly because they refuse to look at instancing like sony did when it was obvious that it would fix every single petition quest problem they ever had. and it did.

[pasi]

Originally Posted by StarLord [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You're not wrong but I'm not sure i see things being any better here. What i read above is "The same problems we have now will transfer to another expansion."

Mostly because they refuse to look at instancing like sony did when it was obvious that it would fix every single petition quest problem they ever had. and it did.

If it wasn't obvious from my post and history, I think instancing (raid zones) solves the majority of issues of early EQ. Its been the solution to rare mob scarcity in every MMORPG (including Everquest) since it was introduced.

[Topgunben]

Originally Posted by pasi [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If it wasn't obvious from my post and history, I think instancing (raid zones) solves the majority of issues of early EQ. Its been the solution to rare mob scarcity in every MMORPG (including Everquest) since it was introduced.

exactly. IMO there is plenty of content, but week-long spawns stifle the raid experience.

[Daldaen]

Originally Posted by pasi [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I love Luclin, but it is a CSR nightmare. I can only imagine how terrible it would be with Project1999s lust for pixels. I'm of the opinion that Luclin CSR issues was the primary reason PoTime was quasi-instanced.

Most mobs are perma-rooted. Amazing for FTE disputes.

Shitty behavior from live:
Engaging Taskmasters (duoable) to FTE cursed cycle.
Griefing enemy guilds by standing in on Cursed AE.
6 manning Rhag1 to claim the cycle until you leave zone.
Blowing blood spawns with no intention of killing Emp.
Leapfrogging in Vex Thal, Sseru, and on the way to High Priest and XtC.

Luclin was a degenerate raid scene on live servers. I can only imagine how much worse it could get here.

A few solutions to the above:

One of the two Rhozth for the cursed cycle is on the 7 day timer, that should be the only one whose FTE matters. But on P99 of course, nerds would be ready to engage and kill those with around the 1 group required to kill it for its entire window just like they poopsocked Trakanon with full CotH groups entire windows.

I assume you're referring to the mass charm AE. I think that's a non-issue. While entertaining, guilds could easily just group up their DPS toons on the charmed players 1-by-1 and kill them very fast. Granted if you have 40 standing in the middle of your raid that would be a problem, but just due to lag that would be a problem regardless.

Per P99 rules Rhag would follow the Statue rule, 20min to engage the next one or it becomes FFA.

Blood slaying is similar to Statue slaying. Guilds eventually came to an agreement to not waste them, but it just takes a few people to screw that up if they want to.

Leapfrogging would be real. Plus the current FTE rules really do not account for perma-rooted mobs. The current guilds that kill said mobs have an agreement amongst themselves of how to handle these but with even more perma rooted mobs like XTC/HP/Rhags, plus leapfrogging it would definitely be interesting.

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Luclin's larger amount of hitpoints and the inability to zone-pull most of these mobs, would help the raid scene a bit since its not so much of a in-and-out style raiding that allows guilds to compete for damn near everything in Velious. When you're having to actually clear up to High Priest, or the Arx chamber for LiS... it would occupy guilds further. Allowing other guilds to raid Velious content they've been missing out on.

--Though in fairness, fixing chase distances would resolve this in its current state anyways--

Once Luclin drops, basically Vulak and AoW are the only raids worth doing for your tank rings, most of the rest of the loot isn't worth guild's time. Tunare still has useful drops but without being able to classicly PBAE down the zone, doubt anyone would continue to bother on a regular basis.

Mostly due to Focii/FT/ATK worn effects on items, the nerd guilds would stay exclusively in Luclin.

I'm sure Luclin on P99 would cause quite a few dumpster fires. Praesertum socking, Emperor socking, and a few other things to prevent guilds from contesting certain content due to keying. But more content is always a good thing for a top-heavy raid scene.

[pasi]

Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

A few solutions to the above:

One of the two Rhozth for the cursed cycle is on the 7 day timer, that should be the only one whose FTE matters. But on P99 of course, nerds would be ready to engage and kill those with around the 1 group required to kill it for its entire window just like they poopsocked Trakanon with full CotH groups entire windows.

I assume you're referring to the mass charm AE. I think that's a non-issue. While entertaining, guilds could easily just group up their DPS toons on the charmed players 1-by-1 and kill them very fast. Granted if you have 40 standing in the middle of your raid that would be a problem, but just due to lag that would be a problem regardless.

Per P99 rules Rhag would follow the Statue rule, 20min to engage the next one or it becomes FFA.

Blood slaying is similar to Statue slaying. Guilds eventually came to an agreement to not waste them, but it just takes a few people to screw that up if they want to.

Leapfrogging would be real. Plus the current FTE rules really do not account for perma-rooted mobs. The current guilds that kill said mobs have an agreement amongst themselves of how to handle these but with even more perma rooted mobs like XTC/HP/Rhags, plus leapfrogging it would definitely be interesting.

----------

Luclin's larger amount of hitpoints and the inability to zone-pull most of these mobs, would help the raid scene a bit since its not so much of a in-and-out style raiding that allows guilds to compete for damn near everything in Velious. When you're having to actually clear up to High Priest, or the Arx chamber for LiS... it would occupy guilds further. Allowing other guilds to raid Velious content they've been missing out on.

--Though in fairness, fixing chase distances would resolve this in its current state anyways--

Once Luclin drops, basically Vulak and AoW are the only raids worth doing for your tank rings, most of the rest of the loot isn't worth guild's time. Tunare still has useful drops but without being able to classicly PBAE down the zone, doubt anyone would continue to bother on a regular basis.

Mostly due to Focii/FT/ATK worn effects on items, the nerd guilds would stay exclusively in Luclin.

I'm sure Luclin on P99 would cause quite a few dumpster fires. Praesertum socking, Emperor socking, and a few other things to prevent guilds from contesting certain content due to keying. But more content is always a good thing for a top-heavy raid scene.

Good post.

EQlive wasn't crystal clear on PnP issues like this. Was pointing out stuff that occurred on the regular in Luclin. I think you underestimate the effect of having 40-50 people charmed and unleashed on the tanks + clerics behind the stone; however it's pretty easy to police.

I doubt people would actually blow Blood spawns here as well. The purpose of blowing Blood was to deny an Emperor you didn't have enough online to kill as it was not your guild's prime-time. Time-zones don't appear to be a thing here.

I'd argue that most of Velious is still worth doing even with Luclin. Spawns are 3-7 days and usually drop 2-4 pieces of loot. Stuff like Belt of Dwarf Slaying, Gauntlets of Dragonslaying, White-dragonscale Boots, etc. are going to be an upgrade for someone even if they aren't BiS. Almost everything in NToV (plus Dozekar) falls into this category as well. Isn't Phara Dar still chain killed on P99? I think the main argument against this is the opportunity cost of exping with that time.

I don't know of any decent solution for leapfrogging. My server had a gentleman's agreement in VT that you could pick the opposite wing and race (i.e. DXT vs DXXT to TVK or DXVT vs TXD to Mini-Aten). I'm not sure how to approach this on HP or XtC as you can engage their boss-specific trash with 2-3 people.

I agree with fixing chase distances. Without doing such, you can actually pull the vast majority of Vex Thal (the ones I'm not aware of how to pull are ones we always CotH'd to). Taunt does not check Z-axis. Pets do account for Z-axis, but it's calculated similarly to just distance to them. The zone is very symmetrical with bosses often on the floor directly above other bosses. Aten Blobs are above TVXs and the like. You can also send pets on Aten Blobs from the corners of the palace on the outer portion of the zone.

Praesertum socking would be something to see.

[StarLord]

Releasing Luclin would make this server full time playable again to me. AAs really keep the max lvls busy and logging in or at least they did on live. Not real sure what a raid geared 60 would do in a normal day in p99. Maybe watch some spam in ec.

A progression server on live isn't a suitable replacement for p99 though. I see those saying as they always do when you suggest something be released on p99 " go play progression" except they are past a pay wall. I'm not personally going to pay a monthly fee to play content i beat 13 years ago, if they where ftp like the live servers maybe. But seeing how Pg servers worked out while i was playing eq2 makes them even less appealing. It's the strangest system they have (normal live servers free) (1 expansion worth of old content 14.99$) Each expansion was getting blown through in a month or less.

I've listened to sirkin's streams enough to know it's never going to happen but i can't help wondering "if you're not going to open any more expansions why bother keeping the server up?"

P.S. meanwhile i see another emu server says it has oow content now ...winning

[Uuruk]

Originally Posted by StarLord [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Releasing Luclin would make this server full time playable again to me. AAs really keep the max lvls busy and logging in or at least they did on live. Not real sure what a raid geared 60 would do in a normal day in p99. Maybe watch some spam in ec.

A progression server on live isn't a suitable replacement for p99 though. I see those saying as they always do when you suggest something be released on p99 " go play progression" except they are past a pay wall. I'm not personally going to pay a monthly fee to play content i beat 13 years ago, if they where ftp like the live servers maybe. But seeing how Pg servers worked out while i was playing eq2 makes them even less appealing. It's the strangest system they have (normal live servers free) (1 expansion worth of old content 14.99$) Each expansion was getting blown through in a month or less.

I've listened to sirkin's streams enough to know it's never going to happen but i can't help wondering "if you're not going to open any more expansions why bother keeping the server up?"

P.S. meanwhile i see another emu server says it has oow content now ...winning

Krono's are like 8 dolllars and once you max level you will never have to pay a sub fee again.

[Zekayy]

Rogean Ripped out the code for AAs along time ago

[Nicoladen]

I could see Luclin being part of a whole new server.
Timeline with expansions should be strict.
If the timeline is followed the Luclin AA's would be in effect before people had made 40 alts and they would focus more on their mains.
This would also make it a healthier raid environment - since people don't have lvl 60 alts logged out at every corner to jump bosses.
Only thing I would remove from Luclin was the ability to setup a vendor in the bazaar and the timed portals which kinda screwed porting classes.

[Daldaen]

Originally Posted by Nicoladen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I could see Luclin being part of a whole new server.
Timeline with expansions should be strict.
If the timeline is followed the Luclin AA's would be in effect before people had made 40 alts and they would focus more on their mains.
This would also make it a healthier raid environment - since people don't have lvl 60 alts logged out at every corner to jump bosses.
Only thing I would remove from Luclin was the ability to setup a vendor in the bazaar and the timed portals which kinda screwed porting classes.

In no way whatsoever did Nexus screw up porting classes. An average of 22.5 min travel time between 5 specific portals is helpful to an extremely narrow set of individuals. Most everyone pays for ports to skip this wait time. This is currently true on Phinigel, almost no one is using the nexus spires. Mostly just noobs with no money or people who are mostly AFK.

Bazaar is incredible and makes you not have to interact with people at their worst when they're trying to make a quick buck flipping/reselling things for a profit.