Norway Liberal Enriched By Diversity

[Csihar]

Originally Posted by Blitzers [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Your ignorance of the ISLAMIC ideology is quite sad. Islam doesn't respect the weak and THE QURAN views YOU as a TOOL to be used against western society. YOU EMBOLDEN the Enemies of western society. They know they can use you and your sickophant ideology to infiltrate your government/lands and when they become the majority will force their culture/religion/ideology upon you. Read the "Quran Dillemna" it's a great book that opens your mind to the truth of ISLAM and its ultimate goal. Research the Guise of Allah, you will find there is no such thing as a PEACEFUL ISLAM. Every member of that FAITH has a role to play in the TOTALITARIAN THEOCRACY Revealed to Muhammad. Islam is a death cult built on slavery and mutilation, your weakness only inspires them.

The only way to defeat the ideology is to destroy it.

Impressive usage of capital letters here. I could really hear you yelling at the computer screen.

Seriously though, why read the Quran Dilemma? Why not read the actual Quran? Tells you much more. It's about as horrible as the Bible. Sometimes worse, sometimes better.

[Blitzers]

Originally Posted by Csihar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Impressive usage of capital letters here. I could really hear you yelling at the computer screen.

Seriously though, why read the Quran Dilemma? Why not read the actual Quran? Tells you much more. It's about as horrible as the Bible. Sometimes worse, sometimes better.

The Quran promotes DECEIT, and characterizes Allahibaba as the "Greatest Deceiver of all" LITERALLY (Sura 3:54) No where in the Bible does it promote deceit or characterize God as a LIAR.

[Danth]

It's hard to compare the two holy books. The Koran is portrayed as the literal word of God, written down by a single individual--a single, perfect, cohesive narrative. You're not really even supposed to translate it. By contrast the various books which compose the Bible were written by many different people over the span of centuries. Even if you limit yourself strictly to the New Testament you're looking at multiple authors, who didn't always agree on everything, with the most prolific being the self-described apostle Paul. He was something of an angry man who made use of the then-small Christian movement for his own political ends after Jesus' death (they never met). Given his dominance of the New Testament and his influence on the early church, the Christian faith is really more of a Paulsian faith, but that doesn't quite have the same ring to it.

Simply put, if you argue with the Bible, you're simply arguing with Paul's or Luke's opinions and interpretations. If you argue with the Koran you're arguing against the (purported) direct word of God himself. The constant re-interpretations and infighting of the christian churches were one of the very issues Muhammed sought to resolve.

Danth

[Csihar]

Originally Posted by Blitzers [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The Quran promotes DECEIT, and characterizes Allahibaba as the "Greatest Deceiver of all" LITERALLY (Sura 3:54) No where in the Bible does it promote deceit or characterize God as a LIAR.

Again I'm impressed by the capital letters.

"And the Lord said to him, 'How?’ And he said, ‘I will go out and be a deceiving spirit in the mouth of all his prophets.’ Then He said, ‘You are to entice him and also prevail. Go and do so.'" (1 Kings 22:22)

The Bible does promote deceit, as you can see above. Also genocide, child murder, slavery, the smashing of babies on the rocks, presenting your virgin daughters for rape to save others, animal abuse etc.

And that Sura 3:54 verse is something that an Arabic speaking person might argue as "the greatest planner of all".

Doesn't matter either way. If it is the correct translation then both promote deceit.

Do you have a response to my question? Why not read the actual Quran to know what it says instead of reading a book about what the Quran says? Jevovah is a terrible entity in both books though. A little better in some aspects and a little worse in other aspects depending on the book.

Originally Posted by Danth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It's hard to compare the two holy books. The Koran is portrayed as the literal word of God, written down by a single individual--a single, perfect, cohesive narrative. You're not really even supposed to translate it. By contrast the various books which compose the Bible were written by many different people over the span of centuries. Even if you limit yourself strictly to the New Testament you're looking at multiple authors, who didn't always agree on everything, with the most prolific being the self-described apostle Paul. He was something of an angry man who made use of the then-small Christian movement for his own political ends after Jesus' death (they never met). Given his dominance of the New Testament and his influence on the early church, the Christian faith is really more of a Paulsian faith, but that doesn't quite have the same ring to it.

Simply put, if you argue with the Bible, you're simply arguing with Paul's or Luke's opinions and interpretations. If you argue with the Koran you're arguing against the (purported) direct word of God himself. The constant re-interpretations and infighting of the christian churches were one of the very issues Muhammed sought to resolve.

Danth

The fact that the Bible clearly has different authors and there are internal contradictions really only says something about its "authenticity" in terms of whether or not the Jewish and Christian faiths are true.

If you read the thing from front to back there is never any doubt that it's (just like the Quran but more poorly) presented as God's book. It's the guide to what God wants you to know and how He wants you to live.

The fact that so many people no longer take it literally has to do with a secular influence more than anything. It's difficult to square certain moral teachings in the Bible nowadays. It's difficult to square disease being the product of demons nowadays. There is ofcourse some serious debate about whether or not certain events are meant to be taken literally (The 7 day creation for example) but most events are presented as fact.
In a lot of the ways the Westborough Baptist Church is a proper representation of Christianity for example. It's not accurate to say "extremist" I think. I'd call most other Christians armchair Christians (that are going to hell according to the doctrine).
Same goes for Muslims and the Quran.

[Cecily]

I don't think we're discussing Islam or the best way to destroy it in this thread. You and I, specifically, were discussing why forgiving someone who wronged you is stupidity. Would you like to answer that?

[Blitzers]

Originally Posted by Cecily [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't think we're discussing Islam or the best way to destroy it in this thread. You and I, specifically, were discussing why forgiving someone who wronged you is stupidity. Would you like to answer that?

Has the rapists asked for forgiveness, has he served out punishment equal to his act?

Your NOT talking about FORGIVENESS, your only concern is your self righteousness. Don't give me this shit about forgiveness, when we're really talking about YOU thinking your sooooooooooo evolved compared to everyone else.

And we're specifically talking about the issue of the man being raped and then being a fool about.

[Cecily]

Well he served 4+ years in prison and was deported. So according to the country with jurisdiction, yes he has been punished. The guy we're speaking of feels guilty because he feels the deportation is a second punishment, after the guy had already served time. We Americans can relate to that with how we feel about double jeopardy.

And I don't think I'm being particularly self righteous. I do think you guys are being assholes about this and making it a big joke. Which happens far too often when men are victims of sexual assault. And you didn't answer my question.

[Daywolf]

meh has nothing to do with forgiveness, self-righteousness or even time served really. It's a matter of prevention. As a victim you see to it that the person isn't just let go to do it to someone else tomorrow (literally). In this case the perpetrator was incarcerated and then kicked out of the country, proportionately correct under the circumstances of the case. His victims guilt is his own confusion, likely brought on by his progressive ideals.

As for executing such people, this would only result in a new assassin class to say the least. Hire an assassin to seduce someone, they cry rape, the mark is executed by the state. I can see a lot of flaws in disproportionate sentences, and likely leading to other such improper uses of justice such as executing the victim like they do under sharia law.

Any form of acceptable disproportionate extremism leads to a disproportionate counter extremism eventually, a cause and effect result. Western law is more based upon an eye for an eye, where as such executions under disproportionate measure within modern law practice I only know of by examples of sharia law, at least as practiced culturally among a number of countries rather than some often odd local law standards (e.g. laws of the wild west etc).

[Sidelle]

Originally Posted by Cecily [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Well he served 4+ years in prison and was deported. So according to the country with jurisdiction, yes he has been punished. The guy we're speaking of feels guilty because he feels the deportation is a second punishment, after the guy had already served time. We Americans can relate to that with how we feel about double jeopardy.

And I don't think I'm being particularly self righteous. I do think you guys are being assholes about this and making it a big joke. Which happens far too often when men are victims of sexual assault. And you didn't answer my question.

You're right. Forgiveness is a personal thing that can only be given by the victim in this case. And it's never a joke when anyone is raped, male or female. I get that. What I'm having a hard time with is why the victim is so much more concerned about the rapist being deported back to Somalia as 'added punishment'. Of course it's more punishment! Or rather, consequences, for his own actions. Don't be a scumbag rapist or we'll have to decline your request for asylum. Simple as that. Sexual predators always re-offend and rape is a devastating crime. No one in their right mind should be more concerned with the future prospects of a rapist being given asylum when there are decent law-abiding asylum-seekers waiting in line that wouldn't go around victimizing people in their host countries.

Yeah let's just forgive him and let him stay so he can rape someone else because his life has been so hard, it's not his fault he's the way he is... etc etc...Only next time he'll murder his victims after raping them to avoid being sent to prison again. He absolutely deserved to fuck off back to Somalia. He screwed up his life all by himself because he's an evil fuck. Good riddance. I don't feel sorry for violent criminals, especially rapists and pedophiles.

I feel badly for the victim in this case and really hope he's getting the best psychological support available. It was really brave of him to speak out. Most of the time men won't even report being raped so they won't get the help they need. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Lune]

Cecily mowing down the savages ITT:

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