Hybrid XP penalty removal date?

[Rararboker]

There is a post somewhere around here that explains how it will work.

[am0n]

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/edit...rs_letter.html

The short of it is that originally, the AMOUNT of experience you HAD determined how much you TOOK. Since a Hybrid needed more to level, an equal level Hybrid HAD more than someone else and hence they TOOK more.

The bandaid patch for removing this was to create free experience when a you killed a creature equal to the Hybrid penalty. They also changed how experience split was calculated to be based on level instead of total experience obtained. This essentially eliminated the Hybrid penalty while at the same time preventing people from suddenly jumping in levels (which is what would have happened if they changed the exp table).

This is why I am a huge advocate for just eliminating the penalty from the start of they create a Re99 server. While it may not be "classic," it would have pretty much no impact on the feel of the classic server while eliminating the need to do goofy gimmicks several expansions later to ultimately remove it anyway.

[winter888]

Originally Posted by am0n [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/edit...rs_letter.html

The short of it is that originally, the AMOUNT of experience you HAD determined how much you TOOK. Since a Hybrid needed more to level, an equal level Hybrid HAD more than someone else and hence they TOOK more.

The bandaid patch for removing this was to create free experience when a you killed a creature equal to the Hybrid penalty. They also changed how experience split was calculated to be based on level instead of total experience obtained. This essentially eliminated the Hybrid penalty while at the same time preventing people from suddenly jumping in levels (which is what would have happened if they changed the exp table).

This is why I am a huge advocate for just eliminating the penalty from the start of they create a Re99 server. While it may not be "classic," it would have pretty much no impact on the feel of the classic server while eliminating the need to do goofy gimmicks several expansions later to ultimately remove it anyway.

This means that we must address the penalty differently: basically, for every kill, after all grouping bonuses and zone bonuses are applied, the experience will be split up according to level, rather than experience. For those classes that do not have a penalty, they will then be given that share. Those classes that have a penalty will get their share, multiplied by their experience penalty. Essentially we are creating extra experience to give to those with a penalty after everyone else has gotten their share.

Since penalties are always a value over "1", this results in the creation of additional experience. And, since shares are determined by level rather than total experience as before, a character will get just as much experience for a kill based upon the size and level of the group, regardless of the class makeup. Finally, everyone in the group gains experience at a faster rate because we're creating the additional experience for those with penalties out of thin air, rather than taking it from other members of the group. That means that after implementation, those without penalties will get more experience for every kill than they would have if they ever grouped with a class with a penalty.

Now you'll notice that we are dividing up experience based upon the LEVEL makeup of the group. For instance, if a level 20 and a level 21 group together, the level 21 will get more experience per kill. That is however only fair since the level 21 does actually contribute more value to the group.

Summary

The changes that we are making in the next patch should have a profound impact upon the game:


Classes no longer have a true class-based experience penalty, making it easier for people to play the class that they want to play, rather than the class that they feel compelled to play due to faster advancement.

Race based penalties are no longer shared with the group, and in truth are not severe enough to greatly impact the advancement speed of any particular race. Even the race with the worst penalty will level no slower than a human monk does now, and in truth will level faster due to the other changes that went in.

The grouping bonus increase, in addition to the other changes, makes grouping much more efficient, without reducing the current efficiency of soloing for those who prefer that route.

Experience modifiers turned up in the other zones should encourage people to spread out, have more fun, and allow those staying behind in other areas to have more fun themselves since the area is less crowded.

All players, assuming that they have an experience penalty, or ever group with anyone who does, will level faster.

Something good to know, hope this change can be implemented soon.

[Swish]

If there's no hybrid penalty on that new server can we have run speed AAs and LDoN added? They were all in classic zones so it wouldn't take patching expansions.

Thanks... oh and beastlords were fun werent they? We can do it without cats this time? Thanks.

(I think its either classic or a pandora's box of stuff that only a minority want to see)

[maskedmelon]

Currently XP earned by a character for a kill is equal to the percent of their total earned XP relative to the combined total earned XP of all group members. Since hybrids require 40% more XP to level, they receive a larger chunk of the cut, hence the oft misunderstood concept of "shared" penalties. Keep in mind that other classes (all except war, rog and priests) have some sort of penalty and there are racial penalties as well, which are currently "shared" in the same way.

Following the "hybrid" patch, XP distribution revised to calculate based off of character level only. Additional XP is created out of nowhere to offset class penalties (except rot/war which retain their lower requirements) and racial penalties are left in place. Due to the revised distribution calculation though, racial penalties are no longer shared following the patch, so if you play a human and duo with your friend who plays an iksar, you'll pull ahead of her.

[am0n]

Originally Posted by Swish [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If there's no hybrid penalty on that new server can we have run speed AAs and LDoN added? They were all in classic zones so it wouldn't take patching expansions.

Thanks... oh and beastlords were fun werent they? We can do it without cats this time? Thanks.

(I think its either classic or a pandora's box of stuff that only a minority want to see)

Except that what you just sarcastically responded with are real and noticeable differences to the game. The experience penalty is something that very few people knew of prior to SoE coming out and talking about it, and even less understood (and still understand). If the experience penalty was removed from the start it would have no noticeable impact on the feel of the classic game, other than some people up in arms because something (that has no impact on them) is different.

[drktmplr12]

Originally Posted by am0n [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If the experience penalty was removed from the start it would have no noticeable impact on the feel of the classic game, other than some people up in arms because something (that has no impact on them) is different.

forgive me if this comes off as rude, i just don't understand the reasoning.

a programming team already thought this out and implemented it on a live server ~15 years ago. are you suggesting the devs fix it one way for blue and then change the fix on re99, even though it has no noticeable impact?

why would someone be motivated to do such a thing? i'm honestly curious.

[Danth]

If you don't like a hybrid with the penalties, odds are you won't like a hybrid without them. Hybrids aren't for everyone. The penalty stinks so much because it makes things drag out when you're not particularly having fun in the first place. Case in point: You don't see many folks complaining about the Iksar Monk experience penalty, although its combined 44% penalty is greater than the stock 40% penalty assigned to a hybrid.

Danth

[TarukShmaruk]

Originally Posted by Danth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If you don't like a hybrid with the penalties, odds are you won't like a hybrid without them. Hybrids aren't for everyone. The penalty stinks so much because it makes things drag out when you're not particularly having fun in the first place. Case in point: You don't see many folks complaining about the Iksar Monk experience penalty, although its combined 44% penalty is greater than the stock 40% penalty assigned to a hybrid.

Danth

That's probably because 1) monk is insanely good class 2) iksar regen is absolutely nuts

A half elf ranger or paladin has a 40% penalty for no real reason. There is nothing amazing about the class that warrants the penalty. Rangers actually suck in a lot of ways and are never going to get much better on this server because they don't really get their due until Luclin AAs.

Super early EQ warriors and rogues both sucked and hybrids were basically warriors but way better so the devs put that penalty in + because of D&D influences.

[Hijiri]

Originally Posted by Danth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If you don't like a hybrid with the penalties, odds are you won't like a hybrid without them. Hybrids aren't for everyone. The penalty stinks so much because it makes things drag out when you're not particularly having fun in the first place. Case in point: You don't see many folks complaining about the Iksar Monk experience penalty, although its combined 44% penalty is greater than the stock 40% penalty assigned to a hybrid.

Danth

One of the dumbest things I've read on this forum in awhile, thanks! Out of the the SK race choices, two are a push (1.4 vs 1.44) and the other 2 are very high compared to iksar monk ( 1.66,1.68 vs 1.4)

I'm sure a lot of players who had hybrids on live from the start like myself had no desire to go down that road again because it kills the hybrid classes.