Fresh start or /movelog for blue rotation server?

[Buriedpast]

Originally Posted by Ziggy [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

all the butthurt in the raid scene is just the effect of being stuck/bottle-necked in kunark for 4x longer than live. even on our low-pop (by live-era standards) server there are far too many people trying to get in on the raid scene, and far too few mobs to support them. velious does a good job of spreading players out more, but i suspect we will be having this same conversation about poopsocking rare velious content if nothing new comes out after 4 years in that expansion...

It has multiple reasons which I won't go in to, but predominantly restricting us from VP until we burnt out from killing weekly Trakanons, until a second guild was keyed for over 9 months stuck the knife in deep. It forced the top guild to become the co-top guild, due to burnout on our part, and a massive steam engine of fresh blood on tmo's part. I don't hate them for it, they did and still do very well. But in no way were they competition especially if VP was opened to us when it should of been. This bottleneck was the start of a long list of problems emerging resulting in a highly inflated 60 raid presence, and ultimately a sour grapes situation.

The other key point of p2k would be we (neckbeards) don't have multiple 60's. We would still be on top no matter where (as players, not guilds!, there is a natural order you fall in based on personality/commitment/playtime/knowledge/friends). But the entire server would still be open to everyone else, and I honestly believe we could create a sharing and open way to play the game at all levels.

The lower and mid tier of the game gets better as it takes more people, more groups etc to achieve things. Unlike now when I can go and 3 man prot/tola with ease and redundancy, it takes groups to do the same on a new server, still in crustacean shell armour etc as we leveled up with velious available. The spread of people also would go a long way to avoid conflict, as camps are far more open with velious available as an alternative to KC for pugs. It's just something I, not anyone else can possibly ever experience on p1999 now or ever.

[Pan]

The thing that's lost in this conversation, I think, is that if there is a niche for shitting things up, humans will shit things up.

Unless there's an enforced behavior set from the top down, any new server will look like this one eventually. That's how humans work.

[kaev]

Originally Posted by Pan [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The thing that's lost in this conversation, I think, is that if there is a niche for shitting things up, humans will shit things up.

Unless there's an enforced behavior set from the top down, any new server will look like this one eventually. That's how humans work.

Server environments on live varied a fair bit, despite a common ruleset. It all depends on how the community comes together, you can't impose good behavior. At best you can minimize rewards for douchebaggery. A focus on control and/or penalties just contributes to the negativity, it makes things worse not better. You can't foster the good when your attention is all on the bad. Life amongst the Puritans was shitty, they had to leave Holland for the New World to stop losing all their children to the friendly people around them.

[Pan]

Originally Posted by kaev [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Server environments on live varied a fair bit, despite a common ruleset. It all depends on how the community comes together, you can't impose good behavior. At best you can minimize rewards for douchebaggery. A focus on control and/or penalties just contributes to the negativity, it makes things worse not better. You can't foster the good when your attention is all on the bad. Life amongst the Puritans was shitty, they had to leave Holland for the New World to stop losing all their children to the friendly people around them.

Good points, I think.

Also in play here is that the CS varied from server to server on live a great deal - depended on the personalities of the GMs (among other things). So it could be more than the server pop (individuals) in play there, too. But, in systems generally, if there's a niche (resources), that niche will be exploited in a way that benefits the most competitive.

[mr_jon3s]

Movelog defeats the whole point of a new server. It would just bring a bunch of items and plat to a new server destroying the economy before it gets a chance. When I think of a new server I think of starting fresh grouping with a bunch of people I don't know and having fun.

[Loadsamoney]

This whole "raid scene inflation, sour grapes" situation is exactly the reason why future MMO's moved to the "instance" system, so everyone can have a shot at the content without it being a shit-slinging contest between guilds. Because EVERYONE deserves a chance at it. Being allowed to even touch special raid mobs shouldn't have to be a matter of knowing the right people and conforming to a very specific guild and their ideals.

As far as this server is concerned, right now it's painful watching equal-level twinks in 50kpp+ gear able to slice through everything so easily when I have to struggle tooth and nail for beans. But I guess you gotta start somewhere and a movelog would not fix that.

Personally, I think there should be another Blue server for Classic>Kunark>Velious, but wipe it once every year, and make people start over. Kind of like Ladder in Diablo 2.

[wwoneo]

Originally Posted by khanable [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Voted fresh start because a classic->kunark->velious progression server would be amazing a few years down the road.

Not interested in it as a "fix" to the raid scene, though.

^ This

[jcr4990]

Originally Posted by Loadsamoney [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This whole "raid scene inflation, sour grapes" situation is exactly the reason why future MMO's moved to the "instance" system, so everyone can have a shot at the content without it being a shit-slinging contest between guilds. Because EVERYONE deserves a chance at it. Being allowed to even touch special raid mobs shouldn't have to be a matter of knowing the right people and conforming to a very specific guild and their ideals.

As far as this server is concerned, right now it's painful watching equal-level twinks in 50kpp+ gear able to slice through everything so easily when I have to struggle tooth and nail for beans. But I guess you gotta start somewhere and a movelog would not fix that.

Personally, I think there should be another Blue server for Classic>Kunark>Velious, but wipe it once every year, and make people start over. Kind of like Ladder in Diablo 2.

Once a year might be too often. But I definitely love this idea. Have one legacy and one progression server. Every X period of time the progression server wipes and all the characters get moved to legacy server and it starts over again. I get sad every time I think about the fact that I was late to the P99 party and missed out on cool stuff that doesn't drop anymore. Plus the fact that I missed out on leveling up together with everybody playing their main char. That must've been a whole different experience. Now it's just groups full of twinked rogs doing 50% of a mob's HP in 1 backstab.

[Hailto]

Only way to make this happen is to be consistently vocal to the devs on p99 that we really want this experience. Would be nice to have one of them give some input about what they think about the idea for the future as well.

[myriverse]

Perpetual restarts seems to make the whole experience pointless imo.

Also, if this is ever done, I can't see anything but a fresh restart being pointed.