Game Mechanics: Dartain the Lost

[Tecmos Deception]

Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If there were minimal evidence and it was saying he should be a pansy

There was. One of your quotes said he was easy [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

In both situations, the details are unknown and the words used mean different things to different people. And that's why I was surprised to see a change so suddenly, even if strong evidence is exceedingly rare. The "err on the side of harder" is perfectly fine; I'd never seen that stated before.

[Daldaen]

Context is important. The beginning of that paragraph includes the phrase "We were on a raid" and near the end is "easy to kill". But I think you were being glib.

I dunno why this surprises people. Before they got the coding to make mobs slow-immune, they had MR immunity to accomplish the same goal.

I'm willing to bet there are quite a few mobs on this server that aren't very magic resistant, that were magic immune during classic.

[Nirgon]

Gj Dald pal

[Pint]

I agree with tecmos, you have 2 very short posts that say he is 'almost' fully mr.. that means nothing, there is no context, it could have been a lvl50 cleric trying to stun him or a 60 shaman trying to slow him, theres a huge difference. Currently on my 60 shaman dartain is very mr if you dont tash and malo him, how can you base this change off such poor information.

The first guy doesn't even remember the npcs name!

[Daldaen]

Problem is, Hole is a very unknown zone in classic. Dartain the Lost didn't appear in most mob databases until after 2001. The ones that had him before that, had minimal info.

It was quite common in classic for mobs to have magic immunity as means to prevent slow from trivializing mobs as I noted above. I suspect that this mob, being the 2nd hardest 'boss' in the Hole, was magic immune as means to prevent slow.

If you find a post in era 2000-2001 saying that they could snare, root or slow Dartain, throw it up. But as is, that guy made a specific point to say he was magic immune. And it makes sense because of above.

Him being soloable on this server by chanters and shamans isn't classic.

[Pint]

Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Him being soloable on this server by chanters and shamans isn't classic.

This is unfortunate motivation for trying to change an npc. You keep saying there is no information on dartain, does that means you found 2 of the 5 posts that exist or 2 of 50? If its 2 of the 5 posts then this looks a lot differently then it does right now.

[Alunova]

1) He already had several anti-MR flags, although he had a very low MR value. This gives some behind the scenes evidence that someone thought he should be resistant.

2) There is more evidence that he should be resistant than there is that he should not be. Find some evidence that he should be slowable and/or soloable in classic.

3) It goes with the group spirit of Everquest. I have no doubt that he was soloable on P99, moreso if/when people understood which immunities he had. I have no doubt that there is or was a character just sitting at his spawnpoint soloing him every 36 hours. I would rather have him remain up and be killed by groups that walk through.

4) His drops are very good items and will remain lucrative even in Velious. His drop chance has increased overall, and his difficulty was only really increased for those who want to solo him. He will still not be a challenge for most groups.

[Daldaen]

Originally Posted by Pint [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This is unfortunate motivation for trying to change an npc. You keep saying there is no information on dartain, does that means you found 2 of the 5 posts that exist or 2 of 50? If its 2 of the 5 posts then this looks a lot differently then it does right now.

EQStractics has him in 2001 guide, but minimal info.
Everlore doesn't have him until 2002
Allakhazam has a single post on Dartain, from 2012, and it claims he never even existed...
Allakhazam posts that I have are from the 3 items on his loot table. Most of them just talk about the lore of Dartain being an apprentice of Miragul. There are very few comments about Dartain himself as a mob, of them probably 5-10, and 2 of those are about his magic immunity. The other 3-4 talk about 2 item drops.

[pasi]

As usual, heres my take.

The guy who posted those comments was part of a raid in 2001. If you go into his post history, you can see he is commenting as a level 52 on a paladin quest in January 2002. You can further go into his profile and see that he left Allakhazam as a 54 paladin with fairly substandard gear in Velious.

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/u...ml?char=107143

I don't think you should implement change based on the findings of what was likely a level <52 paladin on a level 55 mob that may or may not been debuffed.

Also, if you feel like doing some major detective work, this Aegiral is the same one on allakhazam:

http://www.network54.com/Forum/16639/page-68

If you translate the page, you get posts like:

Many thanks to those who were present.
(Apologies to those who do not for reasons x or y could participate, but it is not lo'bjet this post)

It is possible, the Hole was defeated with only two groups (52-56). All this was possible thanks to an intense discovery and coordination of both groups concrete, able to act completely autonomous way.
In fact, we all so prepared and swollen were in block, that we ca finally almost seems easier than it had feared
Excellent jumpers, excellent work enchanting and melees on non mezzables mobs, perfect and efficient management of mana from everyone (the big difficulty of the Hole), in short we have advanced a good pace without let trap by a staggering rate of respawn.
A master stroke so

Among the moments, strong, well be mentioned on the swan dive by the waterfall (which we economise qques hot combts the second part of the city, but given the limited Encounters problems, we could probably go through the too), and the final battle against the powerful Dartain the Lost (so difficult that Verant has discretion to give him two drops at a time like any good self-respecting big mob ).

Absolutely nothing to say more on tactics and technique. Difficult to put the bar or find details a "critical" in this context!

For the shaman FA: it therefore lacks more than two final fights has CoM, I will try to organize this week (probably Wednesday or Thursday evening)


Allocation of loot:

Loots FA:
- Engraved Ring (FA shaman): Kjeld
- Essence of a Ghost: Silh
- Essence of a Ghost: Auril

Non FA Loots
- Loam encrusted sash: Auril
- Withered leather bracers * 2: Fir
- Withered leather gloves: Kjeld
- Withered leather tunic: Auril
- Smoldering brand?
- Imbued Shield of Paineel AC22 str4 poison4 cold4 effect: enduring breath: Aegiral

Loots minors:
- Earthen qques Blades
- Paineel Steel Sleeves

Thank especially Erollisi Marr!
by Aegiral

It is through her ​​that we all survived a bout that could (the) end catastrophically, the Dartain against the Lost!

This guy was incredibly MR, no way to snare, to stun ... Nothing!

And when it started to leak (add 2 spectra) to the tower, incredible but true ben one of my root pass and eventually held suffisemment long as the one before it completes passes porch (hello train).

Divine intervention I tell you!

Yep I deserved this shield!

So... a guy who was at most level 56 (likely 52-54) was fighting a potentially debuffed level 55 mob and claiming the mob was MR based on inability to land stuns (no shit, he's not stunnable). This is the evidence that you're using for change?

We do see he did drop 2 items though.

[pasi]

Bingo, dude was level 52 in August 2001 with the 'MR' posts being posted by him in July 2001.

Aug 23, 2001
Aegiral Paladin 52

http://www.network54.com/Forum/16639/viewall-page-57

Aegiral Paladin 52 / Tados Necrotte 51
by Aegiral

Le reste ne vaut pas la peine que j'en parle.

Affiché le Aug 23, 2001, 11:14 AM