How hard is Velious, really?

[Swish]

Originally Posted by Oleris [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Well, can't wait for you to give us a sample Lord Rogean.

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[webrunner5]

Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think raid mobs need simulated LDs though. 2-3 minute long stuns on people randomly throughout the fight to simulate bad connections back in the day. Make the amount of players stunned scale with the people on hate list (worst computer people would regularly crash because of 60+ man raids etc.). To bring the challenge more in line with classic.

God, don't give them ideas like that, plz. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Orruar]

I don't think donal's bp is all that overpowered in velious. IIRC, they nerfed it to a 30 sec cast immediately when Velious hit. So if you want to maintain a 3 second rot, you need 10 clerics. If you have those 10 clerics using regular CH instead, still on a 3 sec rot, they cast a CH and then med for 20 sec. With a mod rod here and there and a couple necros around, you can maintain a CH chain for long enough to kill most anything.

Also, stuff will be dying faster here than it did back in the day. The fights may be all exactly the same, but the players are not. People are much better at optimizing their DPS now. I mean, I don't recall hardly anyone parsing back in Velious era.

There are 4 things that will make fights challenging, and donal bp does little to address these (and makes number 1 worse actually):
1) fear/gflux messing with ch rot
2) running out of defensive warriors on AoW
3) dps being killed off by ae

[Orruar]

Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think raid mobs need simulated LDs though. 2-3 minute long stuns on people randomly throughout the fight to simulate bad connections back in the day. Make the amount of players stunned scale with the people on hate list (worst computer people would regularly crash because of 60+ man raids etc.). To bring the challenge more in line with classic.

Except that one of the hardest things about LD is someone had to notice when others went LD amongst the chaos, which wasn't always easy. The character wouldn't be dropped immediately, but would instead sit there doing nothing for a minute or two. So it would need to not only stun them, but prevent them from typing into chat that they're stunned. And guilds these days use vent, so you'd basically need to block that somehow. Maybe we can ask the P99 resident DDOS'er for his services to DDOS individual players during raid encounters?

[Fysts]

We never used warriors to tank AoW so im not sure that will be an issue. We would charm 6 or 7 giants and use those along with mage, necro, shaman pets and use all ranged dps. This is the way we did it, as we didn't have 10 full super geared warriors. At some ponts we would send a ranger in and have him ws so rogues and monks could jump in and dps, but then once ws was about up they would all back out and let pets continue the tanking.

[Galelor]

Originally Posted by Orruar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't think donal's bp is all that overpowered in velious. IIRC, they nerfed it to a 30 sec cast immediately when Velious hit. So if you want to maintain a 3 second rot, you need 10 clerics. If you have those 10 clerics using regular CH instead, still on a 3 sec rot, they cast a CH and then med for 20 sec. With a mod rod here and there and a couple necros around, you can maintain a CH chain for long enough to kill most anything.

Also, stuff will be dying faster here than it did back in the day. The fights may be all exactly the same, but the players are not. People are much better at optimizing their DPS now. I mean, I don't recall hardly anyone parsing back in Velious era.

There are 4 things that will make fights challenging, and donal bp does little to address these (and makes number 1 worse actually):
1) fear/gflux messing with ch rot
2) running out of defensive warriors on AoW
3) dps being killed off by ae

This was my exact thought when reading all the complaints about nerfing donals' bps. Also, I seem to remember using 1 second CH chains during hard Velious stuff (but maybe this was during later expansions.) That is 30 clerics for a bp click ch chain...

[Daldaen]

Originally Posted by webrunner5 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

God, don't give them ideas like that, plz. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I thought a stun would be superior to a true LD. But I don't think its a horrible idea :P. They don't want Zerg forces because classic connections couldn't handle it, atleast the bad ones couldn't. If only 20 toons don't need to 'LD'. 40 toons sure 'LD' 2-3. 60+ toons 'LD' all over the place.

Limit it to stuff like raid bosses, those listed on wiki raid encounter page. So that Coldain ring wars and trash don't have it happening.

I think it would be a good way to provide a more classic challenge to combat 3-year Kunark and 14 years of knowledge.

[Atmas]

Velious has a lot of encounters which require significant raid forces and take hours to clear to and complete. It's not like Kunark where almost every mob can be roflstomped within 10 minutes of spawning.

Don't get me wrong some items like NoS will quickly plummet in price because there will be a lot of slots with higher baseline for alternatives. However, that draw dropping loot isn't going to be in every slot that quickly.

[Orruar]

Originally Posted by Orruar [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

There are 4 things that will make fights challenging, and donal bp does little to address these (and makes number 1 worse actually):
1) fear/gflux messing with ch rot
2) running out of defensive warriors on AoW
3) dps being killed off by ae

And the 4th thing that will make fights challenging is retarded people who can't count...

[koros]

Velious will be stomped in record time, I bet everything could be killed on day 1.

Also... most of the LDing issues were completely fixed by Velious.