Best 4 person all caster/priest group

[PlsNoBan]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I have factually provided way more data than you have.

You have. I do not deny this. Unfortunately for you all your data says mage does more damage than shaman. Your OPINION says shaman heals/utility is more important than how much more damage the mage does. You've yet to back this up. Myself and I'd argue most people disagree. You can't heal full hp targets. Malo is covered. Slow is covered. CC is covered. Heals are covered. What benefit do you bring?

[cyxthryth]

Originally Posted by PlsNoBan [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You have. I do not deny this. Unfortunately for you all your data says mage does more damage than shaman. Your OPINION says shaman heals/utility is more important than how much more damage the mage does. You've yet to back this up. Myself and I'd argue most people disagree. You can't heal full hp targets. Malo is covered. Slow is covered. CC is covered. Heals are covered. What benefit do you bring?

Exactly! This really isn't hard hehe. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Originally Posted by cyxthryth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Let's continue our civil discussion guys!

According to DSM, you would not Malo/Slow mobs dying in 30 seconds. In the context of a high level fast-paced killing DPS group, this would presumably be most mobs.

What value does a Shaman add to Enc/Enc/Clr group over a Mage if the Shaman will (as has been irrefutably stated by DSM in this thread) not utilize Malo or Slow for most of the mobs the group is killing hehe? [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by PlsNoBan [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You have. I do not deny this. Unfortunately for you all your data says mage does more damage than shaman. Your OPINION says shaman heals/utility is more important than how much more damage the mage does. You've yet to back this up. Myself and I'd argue most people disagree. You can't heal full hp targets. Malo is covered. Slow is covered. CC is covered. Heals are covered. What benefit do you bring?

Thanks for admitting that. The data shows the extra DPS from a mage isn't helping the group, so it is a matter of fact a broader toolkit and more camp options will help more. Something is better than nothing, even if you choose not to use that something.

[cyxthryth]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Thanks for admitting that. The data shows the extra DPS from a mage isn't helping the group, so it is a matter of fact a broader toolkit and more camp options will help more. Something is better than nothing, even if you choose not to use that something.

Originally Posted by cyxthryth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Let's continue our civil discussion guys!

According to DSM, you would not Malo/Slow mobs dying in 30 seconds. In the context of a high level fast-paced killing DPS group, this would presumably be most mobs.

What value does a Shaman add to Enc/Enc/Clr group over a Mage if the Shaman will (as has been irrefutably stated by DSM in this thread) not utilize Malo or Slow for most of the mobs the group is killing hehe? [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The problem with your post is that the content of your post would seem to imply that you are equating the better (and easier/more convenient) DPS & pet of a Mage as "nothing" - it is not "nothing" and you have provided zero evidence that "it is a matter of fact a broader toolkit and more camp options will help more". Just because you state it is a fact does not make it a fact. It would have to be a fact hehe. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] What it really is is your opinion that it will "help more". This really isn't hard.

[Gloomlord]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You believe I should be insulted, and you also think that belief isn't trolling.

That honestly is some silly mental gymnastics. There is no reason why I "deserve" to be insulted, other than your desire to troll instead of provide a coherent argument.

It is extremely arrogant and delusional to assume you are some arbiter who can judge who is worthy of insult.

Ah, okay.

So the next time you get angry and make insults to somebody, because they acted in an anti-social manner towards you, they have all the reason to say you're a "troll"?

Fuck off with your self-righteousness already.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Gloomlord [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Ah, okay.

So the next time you get angry and make insults to somebody, because they acted in an anti-social manner towards you, they have all the reason to say you're a "troll"?

Fuck off with your self-righteousness already.

The answer is to not get angry and insult someone simply because they disagree with you. That is not how a debate works. You provide evidence and logic to prove your points, not insults.

The only anti-social behavior is your belief that you "deserve" to insult people whenever they fit your imaginary criteria of what you think it takes for someone to "deserve" to be insulted.

[tadkins]

So uh, this thread's gotten a bit too big to read all the way through, but...how much have Wizards been trashed on here? 'Cause that's what I think I want to go back to.

[Gloomlord]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The answer is to not get angry and insult someone simply because they disagree with you. That is not how a debate works. You provide evidence and logic to prove your points, not insults.

The only anti-social behavior is your belief that you "deserve" to insult people whenever they fit your imaginary criteria of what you think it takes for someone to "deserve" to be insulted.

Remember when you said "you mad bro"? You think you're in a position to lecture someone about how to deal with a response you don't like?

I'm not going to let you forget that now, you hypocrite. It'll be a constant reminder of how full of shit you are.

[PlsNoBan]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The data shows the extra DPS from a mage isn't helping the group, so it is a matter of fact a broader toolkit and more camp options will help more.

Disagree. The data shows mage does more damage than shaman and the facts show the group has all the utility it needs and shaman brings largely redundant things. You can SAY the extra DPS from a mage isn't helping but that's just factually incorrect. Again we're talking about a group that doesn't really need ANYTHING from a 4th player. But more dps > healing full hp targets or slowing already slowed targets. Regardless of how much dps or whether or not you get more PH's. Shaman opens up VERY FEW things. Mage also opens up things so thats irrelevant also.

[cyxthryth]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The answer is to not get angry and insult someone simply because they disagree with you. That is not how a debate works. You provide evidence and logic to prove your points, not insults.

The answer is not to ignore facts and dodge questions posed directly to you while claiming that you somehow know the feelings of others and that those others are trolls who's posts are "just insults/memes/trolling" simply because you believe that to be the case (with no evidence to support your - thus unsubstantiated and probably false - claim). That is not how a debate or a civil discussion works. You have to actually be civil, and you have to actually engage in discussion or debate. You can't just dodge all the questions and ignore (irrefutable) facts. This really isn't hard hehe. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The only anti-social behavior is your belief that you "deserve" to insult people whenever they fit your imaginary criteria of what you think it takes for someone to "deserve" to be insulted.

It could be seen as anti-social to specifically ignore someone who is trying (repeatedly) to communicate with you in a civil discussion instead of engaging in actual discussion whenever they don't fit your imaginary criteria of what you are able to reply to when backed into a corner "arguing" from bad faith even though this is intended to be a civil discussion - not an argument hehe. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]