Soulfire

[Ele]

Originally Posted by Tecmos Deception [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Who wants to place bets on whether TMO clerics even use their donals in raids for anything except healing someone who stones/cannis down during buffing?

DL Spam FTW

[Splorf22]

Originally Posted by Alarti0001 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The shitty thing about Soulfire's is they trivialize an encounter, NOT all encounters simultaneously.

Translation from Alarti spinspeak: FE killed something, therefore soulfires need to nerfed.

Also, my whole point is that because Donal's BPs are in fact useful on all encounters simultaneously, they have a greater impact.

[Tiddlywinks]

You don't change the way things work because they are game-breaking if they are already functioning exactly how they were in classic EQ.

Soulfire shouldn't be nerfed.
Donals should be nerfed until the appropriate time.
Ivaynders hoop should never have been nerfed.

This isn't a classic EQ server. It's a few dudes take on it, and that's about it. Sad times.

[Bantam 1]

Originally Posted by SCB [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You don't need to do a CH rotation is the mob is 32k and dies in seconds. I'd wager they only care about Donals because they sell so nicely.

Maybe I'm just a nerd and my job is basically planning irl.....

but if one guild has a lot of Donal's BPs and the clerics to use them then they could easily trivialize the harder Velious content. I'd imagine TMO is only selling ones they get over and beyond what they'd ever actually use. Nothing against TMO here - if I were their guild logistics officer I'd be all on stocking Donal's and grabbing a wavecrasher in Velious ASAP (or whatever its called).

What I don't like here as an upstart myself - is that there are people calling for one to be nerfed because it trivializes content and then scoff at the same nerf for Donals BP.

That stinks of "nerf their toys, but please don't nerf ours".

[lecompte]

This thread should, probably, have been moved to RnF around page 8 but it does occasionally land on topic.

In regards to Soulfire: It is classic, it is broken, it is beautiful. Isn't half the fun of playing a game to death finding new, interesting ways to manipulate content? I want to see 12 down Trak next week...

Lets see if we can do it with ONE group of Woody Warriors with puppet strings and Soulfires.

Omg, so sweet. We can have a weekly challenge. We start with doing it with 18 people, and each time someone pulls it off, the next people who make a stab at it have to do it with one less. Gonna be awesome.

[Alarti0001]

Originally Posted by falkun [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So instead of answering a simple question, you attempt to skirt the issue.
]

Someone is spinning here. It is probably the one using logical fallacies.

What was your question you wanted answered?

[Frieza_Prexus]

Originally Posted by Bantam 1 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

but if one guild has a lot of Donal's BPs

Donal's are actually in high demand for members still due to burn out/turnover and scarcity.

That said, most of TMO supports a Donals nerf on day 1 of Velious, and the dev staff has already commented that this is definitely on the table. Personally, I hope it is done. They were fixed on live the moment the devs were made aware of how broken they were in quantities of 3+. The BP nerf was conditioned upon the occurrence of a particular event (3+ being held by a single guild being used to indefinitely tank something), and that condition will be met day 1 of Velious.

Strict adherence to a timeline is not the only consideration in recreating a classic environment. It should be presumed that timeline adherence is in the server's best interest, but that presumption can be rebutted in situations like this. Of course, the opposition has yet to meet this burden with regards to SoulFire which should clearly stay as it is until that presumption is overcome.

[Alarti0001]

Originally Posted by SCB [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If you're going to cite logical fallacies, make sure you understand them: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_tradition

The server's stated intent ("Classic Everquest" - read as "as Classic as possible given client limitations and other factors") is why people are arguing for Classic mechanics, not out of love for Classic mechanics over love of the server (I'd gladly take no EXP penalty for hybrids, advanced tracking windows, and compass, thanks very much).

By definition, this is not a logical fallacy, and it is laughable that you would pretend this is an appeal to tradition fallacy.

Idiots who try to pretend they understand rhetoric are the worst kind of idiots.

You show yourself in the foot there. Key phrase... "as classic as possible", debating what is possible in a current context is a viable concept. Saying no simply because soulfire were usable in classic does not demonstrate proper thinking. I love how you quote your own interpretation of a phrase and then deem everyone should use that.

Maybe you should learn about rhetoric and fallacy beyond a wiki page haha.

[Alarti0001]

Originally Posted by Splorf22 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Translation from Alarti spinspeak: FE killed something, therefore soulfires need to nerfed.

Also, my whole point is that because Donal's BPs are in fact useful on all encounters simultaneously, they have a greater impact.

Actually, FE killing something cause TMO was super slow to engage we had no reason to still be sitting on our thumbs. Soulfire's need to be nerfed because they are game-breaking. FE shouldn't use them to kill Trak. TMO shouldn't use them to kill AoW. The end.

[falkun]

@Xasten: The opposition doesn't have to meet any kind of burden, SoulFire is already classically implemented. Those wanting it nerfed need to prove its more detrimental to the raid scene than making it unclassic is to the "Classic Vision."

@Alarti: Good admission, considering your logical fallacy a few posts ago. The question: "Are you arguing 'fun' and 'VP key denial' are mutually exclusive?" Otherwise, you've failed to argue anything against my point that TMO kills Trak for VP key denial. Try again.