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  #231  
Old 10-18-2012, 10:07 PM
Ahldagor Ahldagor is offline
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Politic part of the thread...don't matter who you vote for cause you're going to wake up the next day and do whatever it is that you do as if nothing ever happened. Political theater is fun.
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  #232  
Old 10-18-2012, 10:09 PM
Ahldagor Ahldagor is offline
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and thank you all for allowing me to kill an hour at work while taking minute percentages of your paid taxes if applicable. /thank
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  #233  
Old 10-18-2012, 10:16 PM
Alawen Alawen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daldolma [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
In a 2011 review of the state of modern scholarship, Bart Ehrman (who is a secular agnostic) wrote: "He certainly existed, as virtually every competent scholar of antiquity, Christian or non-Christian, agrees"

Michael Grant (a classicist) states that "In recent years, 'no serious scholar has ventured to postulate the non historicity of Jesus' or at any rate very few, and they have not succeeded in disposing of the much stronger, indeed very abundant, evidence to the contrary."

Richard A. Burridge states: "There are those who argue that Jesus is a figment of the Church’s imagination, that there never was a Jesus at all. I have to say that I do not know any respectable critical scholar who says that any more."

Robert E. Van Voorst Jesus Outside the New Testament: An Introduction to the Ancient Evidence Eerdmans Publishing, 2000. ISBN 0-8028-4368-9 page 16 states: "biblical scholars and classical historians regard theories of non-existence of Jesus as effectively refuted"

James D. G. Dunn "Paul's understanding of the death of Jesus" in Sacrifice and Redemption edited by S. W. Sykes (Dec 3, 2007) Cambridge University Press ISBN 052104460X pages 35-36 states that the theories of non-existence of Jesus are "a thoroughly dead thesis"

The Gospels and Jesus by Graham Stanton, 1989 ISBN 0192132415 Oxford University Press, page 145 states : "Today nearly all historians, whether Christians or not, accept that Jesus existed".

Crossan, John Dominic (1995). Jesus: A Revolutionary Biography. HarperOne. p. 145. ISBN 0-06-061662-8. "That he was crucified is as sure as anything historical can ever be, since both Josephus and Tacitus...agree with the Christian accounts on at least that basic fact."

Eddy & Boyd (2007) The Jesus Legend: A Case for the Historical Reliability of the Synoptic Jesus Tradition Baker Academic, ISBN 0-8010-3114-1 page 127 states that it is now "firmly established" that there is non-Christian confirmation of the crucifixion of Jesus

It's not Wikipedia, me, or a plethora of scholars that are being disingenuous. It's you. So again, if you were the unbiased evaluator you claim to be, why do you continue to disregard the overwhelming evidence and general consensus of scholars?
You keep claiming mountains of evidence, when really all that exists are the gospels, Flavius Josephus and Tacitus. Here's the Testimonium Flavianum from Antiquities of the Jews Book 18:

About this time there lived Jesus, a wise man, if indeed one ought to call him a man. For he was one who wrought surprising feats and as a teacher of such people as accept the truth gladly. He won over many Jews and many of the Greeks. He was the Messiah. When Pilate, upon hearing him accused by men of the highest standing amongst us, had condemned him to be crucified, those who had in the first place come to love him did not give up their affection for him. On the third day he appeared to them restored to life, for the prophets of God had prophesied these and countless other marvellous things about him. And the tribe of the Christians, so called after him, has still to this day not disappeared.

Flavius Josephus was an orthodox Jew. His father was a rabbi and his mother was Hebrew royalty. This is a guy who led Jews in the First Jewish-Roman War. Jesus, really Yeshua, was essentially executed for heresy. Do you believe for even one minute that passage wasn't heavily modified by Christian writers? I certainly do not and despite the radical Christian skew of the Wikipedia article, it is not hard to find a slew of antiquities academics who doubt along with me. Many of them have tried to reconstruct the passage. There is general consensus that what I posted is not the original text and at least some of it is later insertion. It is not much of a stretch that the entire passage is an insertion.

There's a short passage in Antiquities as well; it's not as blatantly not written by Josephus but given the major passage, it's not hard to doubt its authenticity.

Here's the passage from Cornelius Tacitus in Annals (heh):

...derived their name and origin from Christ, who, in the reign of Tiberius, had suffered death by the sentence of the procurator Pontius Pilate...

There's no clear evidence of Christian editing here, but it's certainly possible. It's also not obvious if Tacitus is revealing entries from Roman records or repeating what Christians told him. There is strong reason to believe the latter as the passage has to serious errors. Pontius Pilate, who is documented in Roman records, was a prefect, not a procurator. Furthermore, Roman records would have given Jesus' surname, not his assumed religious title.

And that's it. That's your mountains of evidence. If you find reason to doubt either of those entries, which I obviously do, you're reduced back to the bible. None of these documents are contemporary to the alleged life of Christ. They all follow by at least decades. Apparently no one, not a Jew, not a Roman, saw fit to document miracles and large gatherings. In contrast, the life of John the Baptist is well-documented. Despite your ridiculous claims that Jesus' existence is rock solid, it's very flimsy. This is all there is.

But sure, paint me as a lunatic for being a rational critical thinker who understands primary sources and actually looks them up instead of linking Wikipedia pages that I just read for the first time.

Simpleton.
  #234  
Old 10-18-2012, 10:17 PM
Alawen Alawen is offline
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I made multiple typos and I just don't give a fuck if you believe that Jesus lived or that God exists. It's honestly better for me if you do. Have a nice life.
  #235  
Old 10-18-2012, 10:20 PM
hatelore bloodlust hatelore bloodlust is offline
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Default obama sucks ass

How anyone at this point could even support Obama is beyond me, these people are either delusional, or just plain stupid. Lets look at the facts...

The economy= sucks
Race relations= sucks
foreign relations= sucks
Unemployment at the highest level in the history of our country= sucks
Record number on foodstamps= sucks
Your chances of even getting a job?= sucks
Obamacare, noted now to cost over 2.6 trillion dollars to the taxpayers= sucks
Goverment bailouts to our auto companies= sucks ( I am sorry, but this is a capitalistic society, if you produce a shit product for the last 15 years, you really do deserve to fail)
cow-towing to the muslim's who like to blow things up= sucks
Failing to get a gd thing done in your 4 years on office= sucks

I am not some Jump on the bandwagon Romney fan, But to be honest I would vote for YOU or your pet dog over Obama. His policies have done nothing but weaken us as a nation, his corrupt cabinet and congress have done nothing but weaken us further. You really want to see what else this assclown can do for us in 4 years? Really? Seriously?

Watching the debate, I came away with this:

Mr Romney says " Gas prices were at 1.84 cents when you went into office you piece of shit communist, what say you?"
Obama says " Yeah main, but the economy was bad then!"
Mr Romney "Hey assclown, the economy is bad now and the national average is over 3.50, get a life dude.."
Obama says " Ms Piggy, can we please move on, my horse-face wife wants to go eat more chocolate ice-cream and cheeseburgers then try to tell your kids how they should eat"
Ms Piggy says " okay okay, lets move on."

I mean, this guy pretty much sat there with that moderator and lied to the American people about what he said in the Rose garden... He lied, then got her to back him up with his lie. And the sad truth is, a lot of stupid American people who voted for him before probably believed his lies! Instead of fact checking him.

This election , please vote for my pet turtle Ralph. He will surely do a better job then this bum. Who people were stupid enough to think was a messiah in a business suit.
And if anyone really thinks Obama spanked Romney in this debate, you didn't watch the same debate I watched. Just because obama actually spoke this time around, instead of being a empty chair does not mean he won a debate. It just means he spewed more lies to the American people, since he does NOT have a record he can run on.
  #236  
Old 10-18-2012, 10:25 PM
hatelore bloodlust hatelore bloodlust is offline
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You know. I work in office buildings. Since Obama has been in office, you have any idea how many black owners with Obama pictures all over there office I had to lock out and eventually sell there stuff for pennies on the dollar because they could not pay there monthly rent?

I feel bad, that they are disillusioned by this guy and think they will help there people. Black unemployment for males in the 19-32 age bracket are what 14%? The highest they have ever been, If I was black I would be downright pissed off and I would felt VERY let down for the job this guy has done.
  #237  
Old 10-18-2012, 10:29 PM
hatelore bloodlust hatelore bloodlust is offline
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Geesh, so many typos.
  #238  
Old 10-18-2012, 10:35 PM
Lucky Lucky is offline
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To be fair he is making $$, which I can't fault him for. If cheating gets you real money, go for it. Real money > pixels.
[10:53] <@Amelinda> he grabbed my ass and then i broke his nose.
  #239  
Old 10-18-2012, 10:47 PM
hatelore bloodlust hatelore bloodlust is offline
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And I truly do not see Obama winning this upcoming Election. The college kids that had there professors lie to them to vote for Obama will not be coming out in the numbers they did in 2008 to vote for this clown. How can they? They are either occupied as a occupooper, Unable to repay there student loans or still looking for a decent job with that masters degree they had to sacrifice there soul to get.

The Wally-World moms who voted for him in 2008 thinking he would help this country will not turn out either, They can't even afford to buy a box of Cheezits for there poor tot because of this horrid economy.

And the other democrats that got out to vote for him last time , they feel lied to and let down. They sure won't vote for Romney because of there convictions, but they will not be voting for Obama. So I say to them, stay home. Please. Help out by NOT voting so this assclown can be ran out of office and then imprisoned for all the lies and scandals he put the American people through.
  #240  
Old 10-18-2012, 11:15 PM
Reiker000 Reiker000 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hatelore bloodlust [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
You know. I work in office buildings. Since Obama has been in office, you have any idea how many black owners with Obama pictures all over there office I had to lock out and eventually sell there stuff for pennies on the dollar because they could not pay there monthly rent?

I feel bad, that they are disillusioned by this guy and think they will help there people. Black unemployment for males in the 19-32 age bracket are what 14%? The highest they have ever been, If I was black I would be downright pissed off and I would felt VERY let down for the job this guy has done.
I know, WHY IS OBAMA FIRING ALL THE BLACK PEOPLE?!?! IMPEACH HIM NOW!
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