The Great Red Jailbreak of 2014

[Bazia]

Originally Posted by Supreme [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Ok Secrets.

Your brain is kinda pickled so I will give you a pass.

By your rationale everyone should be banned on Red99. No one KNEW it was a GM mistake at the time it happened. No one KNEW devs and GMs had/have a problem with it at the time it happened. ALL people KNEW was that their accounts (ergo ALL banned accounts) were not unbanned. ALL people KNEW was that this also happened before KUNARK and anticipated this was just the last step before VELIOUS release.

Originally Posted by Bazia [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You honestly believe if they decided to unban all accounts intentionally they wouldn't announce it in anyway.

I'm sorry but you're full of shit.

[MC Epic]

Originally Posted by Supreme [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Wait.

You are going to now claim that these players KNEW it was an exploit..was informed that the accounts were not suppose to be unbanned...then proceeded to try and strip their banned accounts by moving items off to their friends accounts?

Sounds legit.

This is really a contradiction to what Durabel said in his opening post...since it was a GM mistake and not a "exploit".

It really doesn't matter at all if they did or didn't know it was an exploit.

If you were to get busted at border patrol for transporting illegal substance that you were "unknowingly coerced into carrying"... you still go to jail.

In this unfortunately common scenario, the problem is that you've associated yourself with individuals who have exploited you, as they exploit every opportunity to profit.

Morale of the story:
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[Supreme]

Originally Posted by Bazia [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You honestly believe if they decided to unban all accounts intentionally they wouldn't announce it in anyway.

I'm sorry but you're full of shit.

Considering that the window that these accounts were unbanned was relatively small how was anyone suppose to know that the unbannings was actually a "GM Mistake"??

[mrproudbeard]

Hey folks, I play with people who knowingly broke the rules! Yeah I didn't question at all that they were re-rolling their 6th rogue or 3rd wizard. It's not my job to police the people I play this game with! I just thought they liked grinding and gearing the exact same class over and over. I definitely should never question when someone I know was previously banned starts doing something shady. Why are there consequences for the bad decisions I make this isn't fair!

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[Jenni D]

why do guilds re-invite and re-gear banned players? surely this condones cheating/exploiting etc

[Tradesonred]

Originally Posted by Tradesonred [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Still, Supremes point is kinda bullet proof. Theres 2 scenarios here.

1. The unbanning and banning happened super fast, like 1-3 hour window. People who took items from banned toons are probably guilty. Still, that 3 hour window could have been used to OOC and strip the toon selling it to randoms.

2. The unbanning lasted for a while 1-2 days. This means banned toons had 48 hours to run around selling everything they had on them to randoms in OOC. Or giving them to people who might have not even known that these were "illegal" items.

Anyway you look at it, its hard to justify any bannings over this, unless someone can pick my reasoning apart and explain to me what im missing.

I sort of feel bad now at going "lol your tears are so delicious" because i assumed everyone was guilty because lookin at it quickly it looks like it. But when you think it through, theres a fuckton of ambiguity about culpability here, unless again someone can explain to me what im missing.

Ok i think ive found it lol its because no account was banned where plat was involved? Still it can mean that someone with a banned account handed over items without telling the source of the items to someone, and that person is banned? So if that person using a banned account was extra perceptive, and could have seen coming the fail implementation of bans over this, could have ran around and gave items to his enemies and then go lolurbanned?

Can Derubael pick this post apart? What am i missing here?

[Faerie]

Originally Posted by Supreme [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Ok Secrets.

Your brain is kinda pickled so I will give you a pass.

By your rationale everyone should be banned on Red99. No one KNEW it was a GM mistake at the time it happened. No one KNEW devs and GMs had/have a problem with it at the time it happened. ALL people KNEW was that their accounts (ergo ALL banned accounts) were not unbanned. ALL people KNEW was that this also happened before KUNARK and anticipated this was just the last step before VELIOUS release.

I refuse to believe that you're all so stupid.

[Bazia]

Originally Posted by Supreme [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Considering that the window that these accounts were unbanned was relatively small how was anyone suppose to know that the unbannings was actually a "GM Mistake"??

Because if it was deliberate it would have been announced, like any large scale actions the staff takes here.

This excuse is weak man, you were better off sticking to the "innocent players got banned" angle really.

[Supreme]

Originally Posted by MC Epic [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It really doesn't matter at all if they did or didn't know it was an exploit.

If you were to get busted at border patrol for transporting illegal substance that you were "unknowingly coerced into carrying"... you still go to jail.

In this unfortunately common scenario, the problem is that you've associated yourself with individuals who have exploited you, as they exploit every opportunity to profit.

Morale of the story:

By your example the issue would have to be that illegal substances suddenly became LEGAL. Then when you moved your goods across the border and gave them to your friend (because they were legal) the DEA sweeps in and arrest you because "they made a mistake" lifting the law allowing the drugs to be transported in the first place.

Argument by analogy must be consistent and parallel or it is just a bad analogy.

In our example people were banned associating with people they thought were FREE and CLEAR of all wrong doing. This is not a case of Hacker A accessing the database and unflagging all banned accounts then proceeding to try and move his items off.

It is a "GM Mistake" that now several innocent players must pay the price for.

[Supreme]

Originally Posted by Jenni D [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

why do guilds re-invite and re-gear banned players? surely this condones cheating/exploiting etc

Limited server...no player base..people hate poop-socking blue raid content?