Item recharging is an exploit of game mechanics

[Brinkman]

Originally Posted by Samoht [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brinkman
And the reason for not maxing the recharge cost could have been many things, maybe they decided to make it a temporary plat sync, using one bug to cancel out other bugs ( that procuded too much plat ). Until they found said fix.

Originally Posted by Samoht [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

They didn't do that, though. They did it for items that were deemed OP to be recharged, and didn't change anything else

You are stating something as a fact when you get on me about it all the time. Please provide proof that SoE deemed ALL the items that had their buy back price increased were OP.

[Samoht]

Sure, let me just find one of your posts talking about the price change on the rez stick...

While we're waiting, were you able to prove that they raised the price on every rechargeable item? Let's see who takes longer!

[Brinkman]

So here is my recap:

The opinions:

In my personal opinion, using common sense, that vendor recharging was not intentionally put in the the game. To me, the way its done just screams bug/exploit.

I feel that VI/SoE didnt have a fix for this, either in coding restrictions, or memory restrictions ( remember this code was written in 1997/1998).

I feel that leaving vendor recharging on P99 will be a detriment to the server. I feel it will lead to more people taking advantage of potential exploits. Leading to more dev time investigating, debating and fixing not yet forseen problems in the future. A broad 1 time sweep of this problem will solve future occurences.

I feel there should be no difference in trivializing content with an exploit, or by any other means, whether it makes killing a raid target trivial or killing an orc pawn trivial or anything inbetween. Its still an exploit, or something not intended.

I feel the balance of these charged items are broken with vendor recharging, they offer longterm rewards for minimal investment, and almost no reinvestment. They are able to be used liberally because they can be recharged, which changes how they are used. I.E. emergency situations vs everyday usage of abilities not normally granted to certain classes.

The Facts:

Vendor recharging items is a classic function, it was not removed until October 9, 2003.

I have never claimed it wasnt classic.

Many Classic functions have been removed from p99 in the past for many reasons. Some of which fall under Bugs/exploits that VI/Soe fixed well after luclin release, and some that VI/SoE never fixed.

Changing this function will have a major impact on the game, both positive and negative.

[Brinkman]

Originally Posted by Samoht [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Sure, let me just find one of your posts talking about the price change on the rez stick...

While we're waiting, were you able to prove that they raised the price on every rechargeable item? Let's see who takes longer!

I dont have to prove that, as I never stated that they raised the prices on all rechareable items. I simply said maybe they raised the prices to create a plat sync. YOU are the one assuming and insisting that in order for that to be true, all rechargeable items would have had their prices changed. You need to read entire posts.

Here read it again

Originally Posted by Brinkman [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

For all we know, they truely didnt have a fix untill october 2003. And the reason for not maxing the recharge cost could have been many things, maybe they decided to make it a temporary plat sync, using one bug to cancel out other bugs ( that procuded too much plat ). Until they found said fix.

[Samoht]

Originally Posted by Brinkman [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Its still an exploit, or something not intended.

Looks like you missed an "in my opinion"

[Brinkman]

Originally Posted by Samoht [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Looks like you missed an "in my opinion"

You gotta be kidding me. That paragraph started with "I feel", and it is under " the opinions " section of my recap.

Originally Posted by Brinkman [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The opinions:


I feel there should be no difference in trivializing content with an exploit, or by any other means, whether it makes killing a raid target trivial or killing an orc pawn trivial or anything inbetween. Its still an exploit, or something not intended.

Talk about taking quoting out of context to the extreme.

looks like you "missed" half my post.

[Brinkman]

Originally Posted by M.Bison [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Lol who are these people? If this is as big as of a problem as you make it out to be, it would be very apparent by now.

As far as the tank spamming prayers clicks. it would work a little better, but its just not as efficient as clicking a midnight mallet for threat. A few clerics w/ complete heal and the resists to resist dragon roar should be able to heal anything in the game atm. Plus u dont even need to recharge a mallet u can just do the quest again.

Honestly, I dont know if its all that apparent now. Thats why I posted this.

There are many charged items that , when looked at on their own seem to not be that big of a deal, but when you combine them with others, or/and amongst are large amount of people. It has the opportunity to possibally make content trivial. One item by itself has been proven this to be true.

What about multiple people, holding multiple clicks. Imagine a raid where all the tanks have snap and nearly permanent agro with mallet and root clicks( root obviously only on immune mobs).

Each group having a person ( preferabally an offtank or tank ) with the ability to complete heal the entire group on call with no mana cost. ( prayers of life ). All damage casters having insta Burst Dps from their Plane and phinny clicks wands Wand of ice, Wand of Conflageration for wiz. Wand of souls for necro, wand of swords mage.

Any player able to charm a mob up to lvl 51 with puppet strings. Maybe not VP but other raids, or even solo.

Multiple people with bladestopper Rune 4 click ( 10 charges ). Agro, basically heals...

This is a just a small sample of what people could have, I am sure I am missing many charged items that would make this even more insane.

The fact these items exist isnt the problem. The fact that once all these items are obtained for the first time, there is almost no secondary investment needed to re-gain the charges. Making the once "hard" decision to use them a non-factor.

Im not saying anyone IS doing this, but its possible. And imo it shouldnt be. replacing strategy, and skillful playing with easymode clicks is not only lame, it makes the entire game trvial. This isnt about taking away one persons fun click roots.

[M.Bison]

Originally Posted by Brinkman [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Honestly, I dont know if its all that apparent now. Thats why I posted this.

There are many charged items that , when looked at on their own seem to not be that big of a deal, but when you combine them with others, or/and amongst are large amount of people. It has the opportunity to possibally make content trivial. One item by itself has been proven this to be true.

What about multiple people, holding multiple clicks. Imagine a raid where all the tanks have snap and nearly permanent agro with mallet and root clicks( root obviously only on immune mobs).

Each group having a person ( preferabally an offtank or tank ) with the ability to complete heal the entire group on call with no mana cost. ( prayers of life ). All damage casters having insta Burst Dps from their Plane and phinny clicks wands Wand of ice, Wand of Conflageration for wiz. Wand of souls for necro, wand of swords mage.

Any player able to charm a mob up to lvl 51 with puppet strings. Maybe not VP but other raids, or even solo.

Multiple people with bladestopper Rune 4 click ( 10 charges ). Agro, basically heals...

This is a just a small sample of what people could have, I am sure I am missing many charged items that would make this even more insane.

The fact these items exist isnt the problem. The fact that once all these items are obtained for the first time, there is almost no secondary investment needed to re-gain the charges. Making the once "hard" decision to use them a non-factor.

Im not saying anyone IS doing this, but its possible. And imo it shouldnt be. replacing strategy, and skillful playing with easymode clicks is not only lame, it makes the entire game trvial. This isnt about taking away one persons fun click roots.

What you just described here is more complicated than just raiding normally. Have u even seen end-game content here? There would be no point in using all those clickies, its just easier to be good at the game and use your spells. Good tanks dont get agro snatched from them, good clerics dont let ppl die without using any clicks. Good dps can do their dmg using their mana and not die(goes back to tanks keeping agro.) All the things you describe make me think you have zero experience in a raid scenario.

Guilds dont raid the way they do because its "the way it ought to be." we raid that way because its the most efficient way. Using all those click items like u suggested is just dumb.

[Crazerous]

the recharging is an exploit however i only want it fixed because i plan on playing on the red99 server. Recharging might not be a problem on blue server but however it IS a problem on red.

[M.Bison]

It's the way classic pvp was back in '99 and its the way pvp will be in '11.
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