Discussion: PvP Deaths (Item/Coin/XP Loot/Gain)

[juicedsixfo]

Originally Posted by Yukahwa [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't think that on a PVP server recreation we need to go through all of the teathing periods of PVP including the length of time when weapons were lootable.

Or, or... the length of time when item loot was available. You've got a giant whole in your logic.

[beentheredonethat]

teams would probably not work due to low population. free for all would work because it simply provides more options like it was on Rallos Zek. I personally like the idea of teams, but I don't see it working out on low population servers.

Just item loot / exp loss has to go. Otherwise everyone will just run around as naked wizard ganking others mid fight. Thats what rallos was for basically 55 levels. That wasn't fun.

[Kope]

Originally Posted by beentheredonethat [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

teams would probably not work due to low population. free for all would work because it simply provides more options like it was on Rallos Zek. I personally like the idea of teams, but I don't see it working out on low population servers.

Just item loot / exp loss has to go. Otherwise everyone will just run around as naked wizard ganking others mid fight. Thats what rallos was for basically 55 levels. That wasn't fun.

This!

Also, if we did teams we couldn't call it red99 anymore, it would have to be rainbow99

[juicedsixfo]

Originally Posted by beentheredonethat [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Just item loot / exp loss has to go. Otherwise everyone will just run around as naked wizard ganking others mid fight. Thats what rallos was for basically 55 levels. That wasn't fun.

It's always been a caster population vs melee population argument. It's not hard to determine who's predominantly in favor of item loot.

It's just not balanced. Melee depend on gear, which can take months to individually acquire, only to get blinded and dropped by 4 casters to lose it. Casters depend on spells, and can basically fight naked. The balance is so extraordinarily lopsided in the favor of casters that it was removed, and the balanced saw an instant turn around.

[Yukahwa]

Item loot was available on Rallos for the entire length of real everquest, which is what P99 is all about emulating. I imagine that this server will progress to velious and not further, which would mean item loot would be in tact for the entire span of the server. Great. I would rather have a COMPLETE rallos zek recreation (by a long shot) than one that doesn't allow item loot right from the get go. When augments hit, there was no reason for me to kill anyone except to make a noob feel bad when I take his DRT because those were the only players that actually had dropable gear. /weak

Item loot means that being strong is risky. It provides incentives for people to kill eachother besides just disputed camps and for the pride of killing another player. It means real thief dirtbags will have an incentive to betray their friends and kill them for loot at an opportune moment. It makes it harder to level..yeah. Who cares.

If I wanted to level in peace and be geared in peace I would keep playing on P99.

Its obvious that people from SZ support their ruleset, VZ/TZ support their ruleset, and people from RZ support theirs. Maybe this arguement can't be won.

For me PVP sucks without item loot.

Envious - yeah, the punishment for death with item loot vs. non item loot is much the same, you lose your time. The time you spent leveling, spent getting your corpse..whatever. But the incentive to kill someone virtually non existent for a lot of players when the only thing a kill earns you is a droplet of pride pixels.

[juicedsixfo]

Originally Posted by Yukahwa [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

But the incentive to kill someone virtually non existent for a lot of players when the only thing a kill earns you is a droplet of pride pixels.

You mean the incentive to "gank" is lower.

[Yukahwa]

Yes. People worth ganking will be twinks, so no one feels bad for them anyways. There are two different games on a RZ type server. High level game people recognize PK types and the dynamic is totally different.

Its so easy to get to level 10 or 12 or 20 and do some fun PVPing at low levels, and there is a lot of incentive to kill ebay twinks at these levels, and no one feels sorry for them. It doesn't cause a lot of problems for non twinks because they just aren't worth killing for their bronze vambraces. They will probably be killed once and more or less left alone.

[Kope]

Originally Posted by Yukahwa [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

They will probably be killed once and more or less left alone.

You have read all the SZ advocate posts right? People intentinally de-levleing someone who fell asleep at his keyboard. Some people will kill a noob again and again and again until they have 0 items left. These people are having "fun" at that point, but will be pissed when the server pop goes to 13 because of all the dickhead moves they've pulled.

You can't think about the people that WILL play on a pvp server. You have to think of the incentive to bring people TO the server who might not otherwise. Longevity of the server > 1 month of fun pvp ganking item looting.

[juicedsixfo]

This argument will never end but I just see more positive effects for the community with item loot out, hand over fist, than I can with leaving item loot in and catering to the 5% of UO players out there.

[Yukahwa]

Kope - that is why I also support "playnice" rules. A fun server can also have "playnice" rules.

Seriously otherwise it might as well be pve only.