Best 4 person all caster/priest group

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Gloomlord [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Funny...

You actually believe we're all angry because you speak the truth?

No, you're not Jesus, DSM. We're not angry because you speak the truth, but because you are a pathetic human being.

Again, this speaks way more about yourself than it does about me. You think I am a pathetic human being simply because I disagree with you about video game DPS numbers. A disagreement you have yet to back up with evidence.

This is really silly. I hold no grudge against you, I simply think you are wrong, and I do not concede to trolls and fallacious arguments.

[Gloomlord]

You hold no grudge because you are an arrogant arsehole, who mistakenly believes himself to be correct.

[PlsNoBan]

Originally Posted by Gloomlord [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I refuse to believe anyone can be this stupid to not see why DPS in a group would be different.

I think we can summarise what's happened here:

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This image made me lol irl. It's shockingly accurate. DSM is the biggest troll on these forums and calls other people trolls more than anyone else. Can't wait for the idiotic reply about his data and nobody else posts data and blablablablafuckingbla

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Gloomlord [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You hold no grudge because you are an arrogant arsehole, who mistakenly believes himself to be correct.

I could also call you an arrogant arsehole with thinks he is correct, and we would be at an impasse. You are certainly displaying those characteristics. The majority of your post history on these forums is insulting me. I am not sure how you think you hold the high ground at all, or are acting nicely, or are even correct.

[PlsNoBan]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I could also call you an arrogant arsehole with thinks he is correct, and we would be at an impasse. You are certainly displaying those characteristics. The majority of your post history on these forums is insulting me. I am not sure how you think you hold the high ground at all, or are acting nicely, or are even correct.

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[Troxx]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If I can do 1350 damage solo, what changes when I deal 1350 damage in a group?.

Because shamans do their best damage with dots. You know that. I know that. We all know it.

In a fast paced group your dots won’t have time to do anything substantial. I know that. You SHOULD know that. We all already know this.

In a fast paced group your only bet is to do your best nuke. Shaman’s best nuke is lower damage, longer cast time, and far less efficient than a mages nukes. Yes you can canni but that takes time away from your casting of said nukes and obligates you to spend even more time torporing yourself. All that time spent casting stuff other than your nuke is meditation time lost and nuke time lost - dps doesn’t happen when you are canni’ing or torporing. While you ARE doing that the mage pet is putting out a respectable sustained 60dps (+/-) as well. Can you lay down more total nuke damage over a sustained period of time than a mage? Probably yeah, assuming the group never runs out of mobs and has no down time. Even though your nuke sucks, has a long cast time and is mana-inefficient, shamans do have excellent mana recovery. I’ll give you that. But your pet is garbage dps compared to a 60 water pet backstabbing and nuking (frequently these days) for 116 dmg a pop.

What you can do solo is irrelevant. I hopped on my shaman last night and solo’d NG for a while. Epic click, bane, pox etc. max summon pet with str/focus stack and haste. Pet averaged about 18dps. It was easy but there was a hell of a lot of time spent canni’ing and torporing just to keep up.

Point is I know precisely what you are capable of DSM. I have a 60 shaman. I HAVE done what I have asked you to do. I already know the answer. I encourage you to actually try it so you can see it for yourself … otherwise you’ll just accuse me of photoshopping parse screenshots or cherry picking data to fit my agenda.

Shamans are not a group dps class. If a group a shaman is in sees the shaman doing respectable dps … it’s only because the groups dps is craptastic and mobs are living long enough for dots to run their full course.

I also have a 60 necro. In groups I don’t bother with dots even though they are better than shaman dots. Why? Shit doesn’t live long enough or them to be effective. Better to fucking lifetap than try to splurt/pyro/cessation stuff.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Because shamans do their best damage with dots. You know that. I know that. We all know it.

In a fast paced group your dots won’t have time to do anything substantial. I know that. You SHOULD know that. We all already know this.

In a fast paced group your only bet is to do your best nuke. Shaman’s best nuke is lower damage, longer cast time, and far less efficient than a mages nukes. Yes you can canni but that takes time away from your casting of said nukes and obligates you to spend even more time torporing yourself. All that time spent casting stuff other than your nuke is meditation time lost and nuke time lost - dps doesn’t happen when you are canni’ing or torporing. While you ARE doing that the mage pet is putting out a respectable sustained 60dps (+/-) as well. Can you lay down more total nuke damage over a sustained period of time than a mage? Probably yeah, assuming the group never runs out of mobs and has no down time. Even though your nuke sucks, has a long cast time and is mana-inefficient, shamans do have excellent mana recovery. I’ll give you that. But your pet is garbage dps compared to a 60 water pet backstabbing and nuking (frequently these days) for 116 dmg a pop.

What you can do solo is irrelevant. I hopped on my shaman last night and solo’d NG for a while. Epic click, bane, pox etc. max summon pet with str/focus stack and haste. Pet averaged about 18dps. It was easy but there was a hell of a lot of time spent canni’ing and torporing just to keep up.

Point is I know precisely what you are capable of DSM. I have a 60 shaman. I HAVE done what I have asked you to do. I already know the answer. I encourage you to actually try it so you can see it for yourself … otherwise you’ll just accuse me of photoshopping parse screenshots or cherry picking data to fit my agenda.

Shamans are not a group dps class. If a group a shaman is in sees the shaman doing respectable dps … it’s only because the groups dps is craptastic and mobs are living long enough for dots to run their full course.

I also have a 60 necro. In groups I don’t bother with dots even though they are better than shaman dots. Why? Shit doesn’t live long enough or them to be effective. Better to fucking lifetap than try to splurt/pyro/cessation stuff.

As I said before, my intent isn't to accuse you of photoshopping your data. My point about photoshopping is simply that asking me to prove a negative is a two way street. If you ask me to prove that my data is valid, I can ask you the same thing, and we would be at an impasse. If you want to make the claim that my data isn't valid for this situation, it is up to YOU to prove it.

I know what a Shaman is capable of too. If you did DPS testing on your Mage, please show it.

The assumption you are making is the only thing people do are fast paced groups, killing trivial content. That has been where this discussion has been stuck at, because it makes a Mage look a bit better (that is the highest DPS gap between Shamans and Mages).

Any fight that matters (which is what level 60s would be doing) will take longer than 30 seconds, and then you can use your DoTs.

If you can chain pull mobs that die in 30 seconds, you can also root/rot to assist in killing stuff faster.

On a mob with 15000 HP or more, a group with 2x Enchanters cannot actually kill the mob in 30 seconds. You would need to hit 500 DPS to kill it in 30 seconds, which 2x Enchanters cannot do mathematically as far as I am aware. Your current data shows a level 47 mob with dual wield capabilities doing 86 DPS, so the Enchanters could do around 200 DPS total between them. We would need to see parse data of really good pets to see what the top-end DPS of charmable pets are. I would love to see that. In that situation the fight is taking long enough with the two Enchanters for a Shaman to DoT successfully. Bane and E-Bolt take less than a minute to finish each. Casting both spells takes a total of 2 ticks, and Bane is 7 ticks, E-bolt is 8 ticks. In one minute, that is already doing 48 DPS, assuming you aren't doing other DoTs/DD's.

[cyxthryth]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I know what a Shaman is capable of too. If you did DPS testing on your Mage, please show it.

Relevant data has been presented to you time and again, it is not our responsibility to ensure you do not ignore it, misunderstand it or misconstrue your true understanding of it hehe. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The assumption you are making is the only thing people do are fast paced groups, killing trivial content. That has been where this discussion has been stuck at, because it makes a Mage look a bit better (that is the highest DPS gap between Shamans and Mages).

No. The (incorrect) assumption you are making is that others have assumed the only thing people do are fast paced groups, killing trivial content. Nobody has stated this is the case that I am aware of, and you have provided no evidence for this, so I am not sure what point you think you are making or refuting hehe. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Any fight that matters (which is what level 60s would be doing) will take longer than 30 seconds, and then you can use your DoTs.

You have provided zero evidence for this, so it remains an unsubstantiated claim hehe. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] This really isn't hard.

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If you can chain pull mobs that die in 30 seconds, you can also root/rot to assist in killing stuff faster.

You can also call the sky red or continue to post irrelevant solo root rotting data, but that would (continue to) be wholly irrelevant, so I am not sure what point you think you are making or refuting hehe. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I am not sure why any of this is difficult.

I am not sure why your post would seem to indicate that you believe others are having difficulty of some kind hehe. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

On a mob with 15000 HP or more, a group with 2x Enchanters cannot actually kill the mob in 30 seconds. You would need to hit 500 DPS to kill it in 30 seconds, which 2x Enchanters and a Mage cannot possibly do mathematically. A Shaman could use their DoTs here.

I am not sure what point you think you are making or refuting hehe. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Irrelevant statements, irrelevant math & irrelevant hypotheticals are simply that - irrelevant. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Toxigen]

https://www.autismspeaks.org/

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by Toxigen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

https://www.autismspeaks.org/

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