How do I report a named kill steal?

[Toothed]

And if Bob needs to take a piss he does it in hadden lake and sends you a tell about it because he is a lizard tyranny with all the required bits to dot such a thing

[Jimjam]

Also Loramin, why did you snip out the section on how a camp is considered 'held'?

That being said, you can absolutely "camp" mobs, and you cannot steal another players 'camp'. In general, if the placeholder or placeholders for a spawn are being killed, that 'camp' can be considered held by the player doing the killing so long as they are keeping the placeholders (or the room if there are no placeholders) cleared, within the same zone, do not die or log off. You do not necessarily need to be at the spawn point to call it 'claimed' while it is uncontested, however, if someone else wishes to contest the 'camp' you do need to return to the 'camp' and maintain a presence at or very near the spawn(s) in order to hold it

You do realise the part you removed affirms the very point I am arguing? It's not your camp until you kill a spawn?

It says 1) kill ph/room to hold camp
2) if someone wishes to contest camp you need to maintain a presence

2 is not triggered unless condition 1) already exists; a camp needs to be held to be contested and to be held you have to had cycled ph/room.

[aaezil]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't believe that's how it works. Think about it: if it was, then no one could ever claim any mob unless they killed the PH first ... but they could never have claimed that PH without having killed it's PH first, and they could never have claimed ...

Clearly if you show up to a camp, and no one else is claiming that camp, you can claim that camp, whether or not you killed the PH, and whether or not the mob is up at the moment or not. The only requirement to claim a camp/spawn point as your own is that it not be taken already and that you are prepared to engage the mob when it spawns (eg. you can't claim a level 60 mob with your level 1).

Thats not how lucan works though. You could sit in lucan’s room with 200 level 60s but you would not have lucan rights unless you were keeping his room cleared. Similarly you could have a raid force at hadden but if you werent there since one of you killing the previous hadden or killing any surrounding mobs (the room) you would not have any claim to hadden

[aaezil]

If two people are sitting at hadden and neither have killed the previous hadden (or if someone did but logged out since then) then neither of them have claim to hadden unless they are killing nearby mobs or something. Just sitting semi afk at a spawn point doesnt give rights to anything as most people understand the current (terrible) rules. In the situation OP described hadden would be FTE rights.

[TheSurgeon]

Originally Posted by Jimjam [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

+1

Mob was technically uncamped and under FTE status. Camps are held by cycling PHers AND maintaining presence at the camp, neither party satisfied both requirements.

No.

We are going to shut this hillbilly thinking the fuck down right here and now. You, and those like you, have such a gross misunderstanding of the letter of the law, and language in general, that it is almost worthy of a scholarly study. I see I need to lay it out brick by fucking brick to end this shinning example of avarice.

In general means that there are exceptions to the rule, and any good faith argument would firmly position Hadden as both a camp and one that does not follow normal doctrine. There is no PH, Place Holder, for a static mob on a set respawn. Hadden with a fishing pole is not the place holder for Hadden with a fishbone earring, just like the Frenzied Ghoul without an FBSS isn't the PH for a Frenzied Ghoul with one. That line of thinking is insane, disingenuous, and can only be brought into existence by a greedy goblin.

Hadden is a camp. A camp that can be claimed by means of presence. No you don't have to kill a random green NPC for it to be considered a camp. We all know good and god damn well that is referring, in general, to traditional camps. Hadden is not traditional, but again, the mob is most certainly a camp.

The camp was claimed and stolen, using nefarious hand waving shit logic from loathsome real world paupers who want to twist words like cheap con men to gain the goods. To an honest person, a sensible person, a mother fucking sane person, or just an intelligent person who isn't a fucking loser hinging their life's worth on pixels, FTE was established for areas with roaming mobs with multiple groups to maintain a line of decency, and to keep raiding guild shenanigans in check. It is not the end all be all faggot fuckwit trump card to snag a named mob. It most fucking certainly doesn't apply to camps where a physical presence is maintained (in traditional camps that presence being the active engagement of mobs, and the quirky non-traditional camps the mere virtue of being there in game prepared to engage within a reasonable amount of time). A reasonable amount of time isn't up at 3 seconds, 20 seconds even 90 seconds. I'll concede that much further past 120 seconds and the waters become murky and you can only keep a six fingered, one eyed, inbred from treasure for so long.

What this server lacks is an appreciable amount of decency. You shouldn't wait, bait, pray, and attempt to snag a mob by ignoring all tells and hoping the person LDs, falls asleep, or had a soggy sock get too full. There shouldn't be mind games required to keep a spawn from people tracking your every move to take it away from you the moment you don't engage a mob within seconds. But that's where we are at. However, the foot comes crashing down, and the dick gets pulled out and pummeled against the forehead of any asinine mother fucker who wants to try and use convenient illiteracy to sway a mind and con a mob from another user.

To say Hadden can't be claimed without killing an unrelated NPC, and that an individual can't claim the camp without having killed Hadden the previous time, makes the one who pronounced the idea a fucking illiterate idiot, or a dishonest skallywag. Both can and should be ignored.

The OP could have been an asshole and said some mean things, but Drest is most certainly a backpedaling, crack smoking, kill stealing fuck.

No misinterpretation of language is going to earn you or anyone like you a win in elf court today chump.

[Triiz]

I can see the point Jimjam is trying to make. Hadden is much more like Sir Lucan than some other random named with a PH. They are both guaranteed set time spawns that spawn outdoors with no PH that people get the timer for and come back later.

The several times I killed Lucan I intentionally left Jentry up to ToT him. No one ever tried to race me for FTE but according to the rules that I never saw publicly stated until 2018 I had no claim to the camp because I wasn't killing Jentry.

It's a dick move to KS Hadden when someone has been sitting there but it's also a dick move to KS Lucan if someone is sitting there but not killing the guards, yet that's the rule.

[aaezil]

Originally Posted by TheSurgeon [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No.

We are going to shut this hillbilly thinking the fuck down right here and now. You, and those like you, have such a gross misunderstanding of the letter of the law, and language in general, that it is almost worthy of a scholarly study. I see I need to lay it out brick by fucking brick to end this shinning example of avarice.

In general means that there are exceptions to the rule, and any good faith argument would firmly position Hadden as both a camp and one that does not follow normal doctrine. There is no PH, Place Holder, for a static mob on a set respawn. Hadden with a fishing pole is not the place holder for Hadden with a fishbone earring, just like the Frenzied Ghoul without an FBSS isn't the PH for a Frenzied Ghoul with one. That line of thinking is insane, disingenuous, and can only be brought into existence by a greedy goblin.

Hadden is a camp. A camp that can be claimed by means of presence. No you don't have to kill a random green NPC for it to be considered a camp. We all know good and god damn well that is referring, in general, to traditional camps. Hadden is not traditional, but again, the mob is most certainly a camp.

The camp was claimed and stolen, using nefarious hand waving shit logic from loathsome real world paupers who want to twist words like cheap con men to gain the goods. To an honest person, a sensible person, a mother fucking sane person, or just an intelligent person who isn't a fucking loser hinging their life's worth on pixels, FTE was established for areas with roaming mobs with multiple groups to maintain a line of decency, and to keep raiding guild shenanigans in check. It is not the end all be all faggot fuckwit trump card to snag a named mob. It most fucking certainly doesn't apply to camps where a physical presence is maintained (in traditional camps that presence being the active engagement of mobs, and the quirky non-traditional camps the mere virtue of being there in game prepared to engage within a reasonable amount of time). A reasonable amount of time isn't up at 3 seconds, 20 seconds even 90 seconds. I'll concede that much further past 120 seconds and the waters become murky and you can only keep a six fingered, one eyed, inbred from treasure for so long.

What this server lacks is an appreciable amount of decency. You shouldn't wait, bait, pray, and attempt to snag a mob by ignoring all tells and hoping the person LDs, falls asleep, or had a soggy sock get too full. There shouldn't be mind games required to keep a spawn from people tracking your every move to take it away from you the moment you don't engage a mob within seconds. But that's where we are at. However, the foot comes crashing down, and the dick gets pulled out and pummeled against the forehead of any asinine mother fucker who wants to try and use convenient illiteracy to sway a mind and con a mob from another user.

To say Hadden can't be claimed without killing an unrelated NPC, and that an individual can't claim the camp without having killed Hadden the previous time, makes the one who pronounced the idea a fucking illiterate idiot, or a dishonest skallywag. Both can and should be ignored.

The OP could have been an asshole and said some mean things, but Drest is most certainly a backpedaling, crack smoking, kill stealing fuck.

No misinterpretation of language is going to earn you or anyone like you a win in elf court today chump.

I think you are the one misunderstanding here. Lucan has no “PH” he is just lucan but the ruling for him is you dont own the camp unless you kill the surrounding npcs (not placeholders - have nothing to do with the spawn itself) in order to claim the camp. Just sitting in the room does not give you claim to the camp. Hadden is the same way.. the mobs next to him are not PHs but if you want to claim him you have to be killing them (or you have to be the one that killed him last spawn and havent logged out)

[aaezil]

Honestly the issue here isnt even so much the players being dicks (guy said he would have handed over the earring if it dropped) the issue is more the rules here are just god awful

[Jimjam]

TheSurgeon I appreciate the depth of thought you've given this, and the time you've taken in your response.

Clearly we have a difference of opinion on whether a mob can be a ph of itself. I think I'd only consider triggered mobs or mobs with a 100% drop rate as not having a ph.

I totally agree camps like this should be first come first served basis, that's how I personally treat them, but it's not really what the rules currently say. Certainly not clearly.

Also, cool your jets. I'm managing to disagree with many of you without resorting to insults.

[Jimjam]

Originally Posted by aaezil [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Honestly the issue here isnt even so much the players being dicks (guy said he would have handed over the earring if it dropped) the issue is more the rules here are just god awful

+1 again [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]