NFL Refs?

[azeth]

^ Yes and there's absolutely nothing wrong with this. The defined contribution style plan (pension) is a dinosaur, and is inherently designed around an up-market.

Its not to be expected that an entity would assume the gain/loss risk nowadays, and they therefore prefer the 401(k), or in the case of teachers the 403(b)(7).

If anyone wants to talk retirement vehicles, by all means you have my ear.

[Sirken]

Originally Posted by azeth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

^ Yes and there's absolutely nothing wrong with this. The defined contribution style plan (pension) is a dinosaur, and is inherently designed around an up-market.

Its not to be expected that an entity would assume the gain/loss risk nowadays, and they therefore prefer the 401(k), or in the case of teachers the 403(b)(7).

If anyone wants to talk retirement vehicles, by all means you have my ear.

slow down there pal. there is absolutely something wrong with that. the NFL gave the referees contracts when they were hired and those contracts were signed, sealed, and delivered. those contracts included pensions.

secondly, the total pension fund for the refs is less than 100million dollars. the NFL makes multi billions of dollars every year. so its not like they cant afford it. hell, the owners could misplace 100million and it would not effect their lives in the slightest. its the equivalent of u dropping 10 cents on the floor and leaving it there because you also do not need it.

that being said, i do agree with you that the economy sucks and pensions are not the best thing in a struggling but rising economy.

However, THEN DON'T MAKE THE REFS SIGN CONTRACTS. thats where the league fucked up. they hired those refs with the promise of a pension afterwards.

the league will have to do the same thing the gas company is doing. deplete the pension in a legal way (its illegal for a company to just take pension money, it must by law be paid out to employees in pensions, at least in IL, which again is why Integrys bought out Peoples Gas. to use the People Gas pension to pay out pensions to the other employees working under the Integrys umbrella).

new refs will not get pensions in their contracts. after the league depletes the pension somehow, and buys out some of the old timers contracts, the new refs will vote. and it will probably have some 401K perks to get the new guys to vote that way instead of for a pension.


you can bet your ass, the new guys at the gas company are fucked if they vote out the pension.

old guy: "you see that jack hammer?"
new guy: "yessir"
old guy: "that's designed to make breaking up the street much easier"
new guy: ~nods~
old guy: ~hands new guy a hammer and chisel~ "get to work kid"

the end.

[Ferok]

Originally Posted by Sirken [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

secondly, the total pension fund for the refs is less than 100million dollars. the NFL makes multi billions of dollars every year. so its not like they cant afford it. hell, the owners could misplace 100million and it would not effect their lives in the slightest. its the equivalent of u dropping 10 cents on the floor and leaving it there because you also do not need it.

Dumb argument. Also, the compensation for officials (who are part time employees) is pretty staggering given the job performed. I wouldn't be crying for them either.

[Sirken]

Originally Posted by Ferok [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Dumb argument. Also, the compensation for officials (who are part time employees) is pretty staggering given the job performed. I wouldn't be crying for them either.

im sorry u feel its dumb, but its still very true. and on one is asking you to cry for them.

as far as them getting paid to much, thats the NFLs fault. it was the NFL that offered those contracts to the refs as they were hired with promise of a pension.

according to "http://www.theatlantic.com/entertainment/archive/2012/09/the-nfls-refpocalypse-is-over-did-anyone-win/262948/" the refs make $8,764 a game. and some of the refs pick up summer work as refs for NFL training camps, i couldnt find how much they get paid for training camp, i imagine less than an actual game.

if u let me work for u for 25 years under the promise of contract to give me a pension, and u try to take it from me at year 23, i'm going to put a bullet through your head and roll the dice on my chances in court. because both if u have enough money, you always have a chance to get away with it in this country, but also because you essentially just ruined the rest of my life anyways.

and btw, union contracts can not just be cancelled, they are nothing like NFL player contracts. real life union employees cant just get "cut" (fired) without reason. that's one of the main reasons that unions exist in the first place.

Originally Posted by azeth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Something kind of neat i caught on the radio yesterday in regard to the pension funds -
Mike Pereira the former VP of officiating was a phone-in guest for Felger & Mazz on 98.5.
His quote, "whenever we hired a new official I made two memorable phonecalls. One to the guy we were hiring, then one to his wife to let her know we'd be taking care of them even after he retires"
He was pretty upset at the NFL looking to deny what he personally promised.

if i was Pereira i'd be pissed about it too, it makes him look like an asshole, regardless of it not being his fault. i know if i promised people post job security that didnt exist, id feel like an asshole too.

[Ferok]

Originally Posted by Sirken [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

im sorry u feel its dumb, but its still very true. and on one is asking you to cry for them.

Your comparison is off by several orders of magnitude, for starters. Second off, none of it matters. Therefore, that particular argument is both untrue and dumb.

As far as the nature of contracts, unions, etc - that's all fine and well. If they can maneuver legally to get out of those contracts/pay them out, then good for them. If not, sucks to be them. Either way, no one is breaking any laws here as far as I can tell.

Now, you may not like it - but that's irrelevant. If they don't want to hire any more union labor, that should be their prerogative. If they don't want to offer pensions to new employees, that too should be their prerogative. As long as they're not robbing employees of earned money, I don't see a problem.

Now, the free market dictates that perhaps their talent pool suffers by decreasing compensation. If this proves to be the case, then that's what they get. But I'm betting they'll find talent that is more-than-adequate for the offered compensation.

[azeth]

Something kind of neat i caught on the radio yesterday in regard to the pension funds -

Mike Pereira the former VP of officiating was a phone-in guest for Felger & Mazz on 98.5.

His quote, "whenever we hired a new official I made two memorable phonecalls. One to the guy we were hiring, then one to his wife to let her know we'd be taking care of them even after he retires"

He was pretty upset at the NFL looking to deny what he personally promised.