Updated weapon aggro chart?

[Ransurian]

Originally Posted by greatdane [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Eh, not really. Root is useful when it's spammable and on demand, but not even slightly reliable as a weapon proc. When you then add the fact that it's very likely to break on the first instance of non-physical damage, it's silly to call Herbalist Spade the best aggro weapon.

In a grind session, it probably won't proc at all on any given mob. Like the odds are maybe 10-20% that you'll ever root a mob, especially once you take resists into account. Root generates almost no aggro through its inherent effect, so it's all predicated on the mechanical aspect of a rooted mob always hitting the closest target.

Compare this to other conventional aggro weapons. When you proc a Frostbringer or whatever, you've almost certainly secured aggro on that mob for the whole 20 seconds it takes to kill it. With a spade, however, you only secure aggro if you proc and it isn't resisted and the root lasts throughout the fight.

Even if we discount mobs that can't be rooted at all (you're unlikely to grind on those), the layers of caveats to root's aggro-holding capabilities make it wildly unreliable as a weapon proc. It's nice on an earth pet that casts it every six seconds or something, but given the abysmal default proc rate and the strong likelihood that any tank in an exp group has crap dex if they aren't buffed by a shaman, it's simply not a good aggro weapon.

Go with weapons for which it doesn't matter if the proc is resisted or not, and where it can't break and become irrelevant at any moment. Besides, you have a 50% higher proc rate when dual-wielding (assuming both weapons have a real aggro proc) than with a 2h weapon. When all of that is taken into account, it takes a special level of ignorance to call the idiot's spade a suitable tank weapon.

As a rogue, I always groan when the tank pulls out a spade. It means he doesn't have aggro 90% of the time, and even when he does proc a root and it isn't resisted, it's unlikely to last more than a few seconds if the group has casters and/or DD-proccing pets. Meanwhile, if the tank knows how the game works and shows up with proper tank weapons, I know that I can go all out as soon as I see the proc graphics of that Frostbringer/Wavecrasher combo or whatever it is he's using. The spade is not a reliable tank weapon at all.

Bruh, lol. Frostbringer proc doesn’t cause that much hate and the ratio sucks. Your typical raid geared dime-a-dozen gigachad rogue that you see everywhere these days is going to have aggro again within like 10 or 15 seconds of a Frostbringer proc.

I’ve tried various combinations of ToV weapons as well as Willsappper, Frostreaver, etc etc and I’ve found that Herbalist’s Spade is generally the best tool for general purpose group use. Frostreaver is a close second thanks to the high ratio and solid proc, but nothing beats root for guaranteeing that even the most obnoxiously overgeared rogues and monks can’t tear aggro from you until the mob is dead. A decent haste item like CoF and a spade is all you need for smooth sailing from 49 to 60.

[Solist]

Do the most dps

XP groups aggro is irrelevent 90% of the time. Pick highest dps combo you have (reaver, exquisite, etc etc).

Once you're 60, aggro only matters so much as to say use any of the top 10 weapons in either hand and you'll be fine.

[Naethyn]

The best aggro weapon is your haste.

[Snaggles]

Either you are wrong or every raid warrior on the server is wrong.
Wanna flip a coin?

[zelld52]

Ok now parse WESS damage vs. Herbalist Spade damage.

What did you find?

Herbalist Spade isn't just good because of the proc, but it's almost a 1 ratio. So it's great damage too. Especially at 50+.

WESS is sub 0.5 ratio. Awful.

By the logic of "It won't proc enough" - WeSS isn't worth shit either. 1h weapons do not proc more than 2h weapons.

As a tank, I'd rather be doing 150 damage per swing rather than 35 per swing.

The 10-20% chance of proc, where are these numbers coming from? Horseshit lol.

I've seen tanks hold aggro better with Shovel of the Harvest over many proccing weapons because of the burst damage. It's the same reason a rogue is hard to pull aggro from. Not because of their procs, but because of the amount of damage done in one round.

[PatChapp]

Originally Posted by zelld52 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Ok now parse WESS damage vs. Herbalist Spade damage.

What did you find?

Herbalist Spade isn't just good because of the proc, but it's almost a 1 ratio. So it's great damage too. Especially at 50+.

WESS is sub 0.5 ratio. Awful.

By the logic of "It won't proc enough" - WeSS isn't worth shit either. 1h weapons do not proc more than 2h weapons.

As a tank, I'd rather be doing 150 damage per swing rather than 35 per swing.

The 10-20% chance of proc, where are these numbers coming from? Horseshit lol.

I've seen tanks hold aggro better with Shovel of the Harvest over many proccing weapons because of the burst damage. It's the same reason a rogue is hard to pull aggro from. Not because of their procs, but because of the amount of damage done in one round.

Yeah I used a herbalist spade from 30-55ish,held agro fine in groups
Once you start competing with epic rogues and monks it only works after a proc
For group content just having someone root the mobs is the best agro.

[Jimjam]

Wouldn’t wess be in secondary if duoed with a frostbringer?

Thats half procrate

[Snaggles]

No, it’s up to the threshold. IE it’s capped outside additional damage that is done by the spell.

Movement limiting spells are not good for aggro. Root is only good for proximity tanking (which still has its place). The old root net meta used to make sense since recharging was cheap and you could carry a bagful. These days the scepter per click sucks (it’s prob like 200) but 10 clicks is something to write home about.

Blinding Poison III is a “spell”, it having three lines doesn’t make it plural. Not these days if you read the patch.

[Malk]

Originally Posted by Snaggles [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Blinding Poison III is a “spell”, it having three lines doesn’t make it plural. Not these days if you read the patch.

Rogean: Adjusted aggro formula calculations for spell SPAs: AC/Atk Debuff, Snare, Slow, Blind, Stun, Fear, Spinstun, Charm, Mez.

Rogean: The SPA above are capped at 1200 aggro, or 400 if the player is not high enough level to use the spell (Ex: Procs).

Rogean: Removed an overall spell cap of 400 aggro if player was not high enough level for the spell. This is instead capped per SPA Above.

As i read it, the WESS proc has 2 different SPAs, each having a cap of 400.

[Snaggles]

Hmm I expected a Monday but not one where the WESS might not suck.
I never saw the note from Rogean. I guess it’s possible…