Is the UN a way to reduce GM workload or a GM enforced Mafia? [Green]

[Fammaden]

Originally Posted by salren [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I am unbiased as I don't play on green, but I am curious about this general question.

My understanding was that GMs enforce player-made agreements. So, if guilds A, B, and C (the UN) made an agreement to do a Sky rotation, and then guild B showed up during guild A's slot, a GM would enforce the player-made agreement between these guilds.

However, guild D is not part or party to any of the agreements between A, B, and C. So there is no agreement here for a GM to enforce.

Yes? No?

Theoretically but the guild in question, Lineage, has not been in any way prepared to go toe-to-toe with ST or Fed on this content so it doesn't really matter. And this is why guild stay in the UN, they'd prefer to get some slots in sky than to end up on the outside looking in like Lineage.

If a guild that had the power and determination to actually snipe significant content were to buck the UN and go rogue that would be interesting. But that's not where we are and isn't about to change. Kunark will see a bigger shakeup in how these guilds all interact on the whole, since it will all be contested long window repop targets, rather than the current classic planar trash clears which everyone is motivated to rotate and share.

Another issue though is what was seen both in Fear early on and in Sky recently with Lineage trying to force their way in, it just became a DPS race on stupid trash mobs at their spawn point while expecting GM's to study each mob's identifier and look at the server log to verify who got the FTE. Which is absurd to expect of them. I assume that's related to Galach's quote about letting him know for any issues, the issues would be KS'ing each other on sky trash.

[the_finn]

Originally Posted by Fammaden [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Theoretically but the guild in question, Lineage, has not been in any way prepared to go toe-to-toe with ST or Fed on this content so it doesn't really matter. And this is why guild stay in the UN, they'd prefer to get some slots in sky than to end up on the outside looking in like Lineage.

If a guild that had the power and determination to actually snipe significant content were to buck the UN and go rogue that would be interesting. But that's not where we are and isn't about to change. Kunark will see a bigger shakeup in how these guilds all interact on the whole, since it will all be contested long window repop targets, rather than the current classic planar trash clears which everyone is motivated to rotate and share.

Another issue though is what was seen both in Fear early on and in Sky recently with Lineage trying to force their way in, it just became a DPS race on stupid trash mobs at their spawn point while expecting GM's to study each mob's identifier and look at the server log to verify who got the FTE. Which is absurd to expect of them. I assume that's related to Galach's quote about letting him know for any issues, the issues would be KS'ing each other on sky trash.

Your getting close man, but you still can't see the underlying issue. You said:
Theoretically but the guild...has not been in any way prepared to go toe-to-toe...so it doesn't really matter.
So you are literally saying this is actually run in that way, and since it has not actually been challenged yet it doesn't really matter.

Your closing statement of:
...expecting GM's to study each mob's identifier and look at the server log to verify who got the FTE. Which is absurd to expect of them.
I fully agree with you. Pretty sure guild D did not file a single petition as they did not expect the GMs to do the studying, however, the A, B, C guilds (the ones that agreed with each other when they can go where) feel entitled to the zone and therefore did file petitions. So, yeah, "Which is absurd to expect of them."

[cd288]

Originally Posted by the_finn [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Your getting close man, but you still can't see the underlying issue. You said:
Theoretically but the guild...has not been in any way prepared to go toe-to-toe...so it doesn't really matter.
So you are literally saying this is actually run in that way, and since it has not actually been challenged yet it doesn't really matter.

Your closing statement of:
...expecting GM's to study each mob's identifier and look at the server log to verify who got the FTE. Which is absurd to expect of them.
I fully agree with you. Pretty sure guild D did not file a single petition as they did not expect the GMs to do the studying, however, the A, B, C guilds (the ones that agreed with each other when they can go where) feel entitled to the zone and therefore did file petitions. So, yeah, "Which is absurd to expect of them."

This whole thread sounds like guild D essentially saying “hey look at all these other people agreeing to get along and share to some extent, we don’t like that so we’re gonna just try and take everything we can.” Then guild D fails and complains that there is an agreed upon rotation between the group of guilds that GuildD to try and screw over. I guess I can respect the gamble...but it didn’t work so now you guys are essentially screwed because you tried to be pixel hungry jerks

[lullzy]

[1:14 PM] Galach: @Phatez
[1:15 PM] Phatez: He accepted 12h of uncontested sky, and was aware that we were moving to a permanent rotation on friday.
[1:15 PM] Perplexa <Kingdom>: Vill I think you were told to stop kicking people you dont agree with
[1:15 PM] Phatez: I kicked him
[1:15 PM] Phatez: After accepting his 12h of uncontested 2-4, per our player agreement, he then contested ST sky last night.
[1:15 PM] Phatez: AFAIK he was brought back to this channel to discuss sky. Something he has proven he is unwilling to do.
[1:16 PM] Perplexa <Kingdom>: What exactly was the whole agreement though?
[1:16 PM] Phatez: We are discussing the long term agreement tonight at midnight.
[1:16 PM] Phatez: For this week they were given 12h uncontested.
[1:16 PM] Phatez: We also let them loot our key rots on island 2-4 the last couple of days, for nothing in return.
[1:17 PM] Phatez: Last night they decided to kill our Gorg on spawn.
[1:17 PM] Phatez: NayrueToday at 1:04 PM
we're contesting everyone until we got a slot
[1:21 PM] Perplexa <Kingdom>: Seems very silly, ST got what 16 clears of sky so far. Fed has gotten 8, Lineage 1
[1:21 PM] Phatez: 2 weeks
[1:21 PM] Phatez: That was when the formal rotation was going to start from the begining.
[1:21 PM] Phatez: 2 weeks is on friday... we are having a meeting to formalize slots tonight.
[1:21 PM] Galach: just LMK if issues arise with them in sky today
[1:23 PM] Perplexa <Kingdom>: I really dont understand the logic behind allowing competitive sky. Feds pretty much took the short end of the stick just to save all the possible headaches. We were content however. I do sympathize with Lineages position of being told you only get 1 slot after fighting tooth and nail for it.
[1:23 PM] Phatez: The biggest issue I have with it, Perplexa, is that they agreed to 12h uncontested. As soon as that ended they went right back to stealing mobs in sky.
[1:23 PM] Phatez: My plan I was going to discuss tonight was 2.5 slots Fed, 2.5 slots ST, 2 slots lineage, 1 FOH 1 CI
[1:23 PM] Legendarymonk <Venerate>: It's crazy because as soon as it was done he was right back to being maibbin
[1:23 PM] Phatez: 5 slots open raid
[1:24 PM] Phatez: thats what i was going to propose at least
[1:24 PM] Phatez: I really don't think I am the bad guy here. Maybe I am.
[1:25 PM] Jack <Dark Men of Odus>: wait you mean each guild in the federation doesn't get the same number of slots as ST??
[1:25 PM] Jack <Dark Men of Odus>: ???
[1:25 PM] Phatez: We gotta discuss it tonight...
[1:26 PM] Phatez: I asked Pac to brainstorm how to divy up the 9 slots as well... I wanted to see what he came up with.
[1:26 PM] Phatez: My opinion is Mon-Fri AM open raid
[1:26 PM] Phatez: which leaves 9 slots, Mon-Fri PM, Sat/Sun AM/PM
[1:32 PM] Perplexa <Kingdom>: Phatez, was it actually you that kicked Nayrue though?
[1:32 PM] Vill <Seal Team>: It was
[1:33 PM] Perplexa <Kingdom>: How
[1:33 PM] Vill <Seal Team>: What do you mean, how?
[1:33 PM] Phatez: right click
[1:33 PM] Phatez: bann player
[1:33 PM] Phatez: right click
[1:33 PM] Phatez: kick player
[1:33 PM] Perplexa <Kingdom>: Why does ST have permissions to kick without the mod role?
[1:33 PM] Phatez: This is my server
[1:33 PM] Perplexa <Kingdom>: ah I see

[the_finn]

salren, you are correct. That's how Green works. lol, welcome to the party

[the_finn]

Wait!

CORRECTION

Question was: However, guild D is not part or party to any of the agreements between A, B, and C. So there is no agreement here for a GM to enforce.

Answer is:
The GMs are in guild A, so if guild D does not comply, the GMs and the large guilds will just bully them out of the game. Get them banned from locations, do GM petitions against them (that the GM who is in A is literally the judge on). It's a pretty neat system.

[cd288]

Originally Posted by the_finn [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Wait!

CORRECTION

Question was: However, guild D is not part or party to any of the agreements between A, B, and C. So there is no agreement here for a GM to enforce.

Answer is:
The GMs are in guild A, so if guild D does not comply, the GMs and the large guilds will just bully them out of the game. Get them banned from locations, do GM petitions against them (that the GM who is in A is literally the judge on). It's a pretty neat system.

I believe the actual GMs aren’t allowed to play on P99

[AgentEpilot]

Originally Posted by cd288 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I believe the actual GMs aren’t allowed to play on P99

Just not the server they GM for.

[RecondoJoe]

Originally Posted by AgentEpilot [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Just not the server they GM for.

I'm like, really positive that a GM whose name I'm not going to mention does play on Green, which I personally don't have a problem with given the fact that there's basically only 2 servers, and a lot of people genuinely prefer playing on Green for a fresh and new experience.

[galach]

Originally Posted by RecondoJoe [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'm like, really positive that a GM whose name I'm not going to mention does play on Green, which I personally don't have a problem with given the fact that there's basically only 2 servers, and a lot of people genuinely prefer playing on Green for a fresh and new experience.

false