Quick question regarding necro race

[Troxx]

The numbers in your post are out of whack.

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Here's some math to help you decide. The HP to mana ratio for Arch Lich is 0.646. An Iksar sitting gets 12 hp a tick, or 2 per second, which translates to 1.292 mana per second.

Devouring Darkness costs 400 mana. In 310 seconds, or about every 5 minutes, an Iksar gets to cast an extra Devouring Darkness. If you can live knowing that you will be able to cast one less Devouring Darkness every five minutes as a dark elf, you absolutely should keep your current character; otherwise reroll.

Arch lich is 1:1 (20 lost 20 gained)
Demi Lich is 1:0.646 (48 lost 31 gained)
A sitting iksar gets 18 (not 12)

Regardless, you're thinking about this the wrong way.

Standing at 60 in Demi lich a non-iksar loses 44 hp a tick. Iksar loses 36. Non iksar will lose health and need to vexing in 2.27 minutes. Iksar in 2.78 mins.

Sitting at 60 in Demi lich a non-iksar loses 41 hp a tick. Iksar loses 30. Non iksar will lose health and need to vexing in 2.43 minutes. Iksar in 3.33 mins.

Standing at 60 in ARCH lich a non-iksar loses 16 hp a tick. Iksar loses 8. Non iksar will lose health and need to vexing in 6.25 minutes. Iksar in 12.5 mins.

Sitting at 60 in ARCH lich a non-iksar loses 13 hp a tick. Iksar loses 2. Non iksar will lose health and need to vexing in 7.69 minutes. Iksar in 50 mins.


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Standing at 51 in Lich a non-iksar loses 20 hp a tick. Iksar loses 16. Non iksar will lose health and need to bond of death in 3.6 minutes. Iksar in 4.5 mins.

Sitting at 51 in Lich a non-iksar loses 17 hp a tick. Iksar loses 10. Non iksar will lose health and need to bond of death in 4.23 minutes. Iksar in 7.2 mins.

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Standing at 56 in Lich a non-iksar loses 19 hp a tick. Iksar loses 12. Non iksar will lose health and need to bond of death in 3.79 minutes. Iksar in 7.2 mins.

Sitting at 56 in Lich a non-iksar loses 16 hp a tick. Iksar loses 6. Non iksar will lose health and need to bond of death in 4.5 minutes. Iksar in 12 mins.


Recap for sitting:

At 60 in Demi lich non iksar has to tap 37% more often.
At 60 in Arch lich non iksar has to tap 650% more often.
At 56 in Lich non iksar has to tap 267% more often.
At 51 in Lich non iksar has to tap 170% more often.

As has been mentioned multiple times, none of this is so game breaking that a non iksar necromancer can't function ... but the difference is quite huge.

[loramin]

Originally Posted by Razaz [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

End of the day, Iksar wins the min/max numbers game. If you don't like the Iksar lore, city, aesthetics, or whatever, then play something else. You will still be able to do everything an Iksar can, but you will always be at a slight disadvantage.

Yes: we've already established that Iksar is superior. Anyone who only cares about min/max could have stopped reading this thread five pages ago.

I'm trying to establish how much they win, ie. how much of a slight disadvantage non-Iksar have. Because to some people min/max isn't the only factor, and if you want to compare the min/max benefits against other factors you need some basis to do so.

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

A sitting iksar gets 18 (not 12)

Yes, but non-Iksar get 6, so Iksar are only net 12 better.

Also, I'm not sure that wall of text is going to be helpful for the purpose it's trying to serve. I doubt OP is going to read all of the above and then meaningfully compare it to "how much of a pain will it be to redo levels 1-12?" or "how much cooler do dark elves look?" ... because the human brain just doesn't work that way, especially when it has to compare very disparate things.

But it can make simple comparisons like "is looking like a dark elf cool enough to be worth giving up an extra darkness/5 min at 60?"

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yes, but non-Iksar get 6, so Iksar are only net 12 better.

Non-iksars get 7 ... so iksars are only net 11 better.

Sitting at 60 in Demi lich a non-iksar loses 41 hp a tick. Iksar loses 30. Non iksar will lose health and need to vexing in 2.43 minutes. Iksar in 3.33 mins.

Over 20 minutes a non-iksar will have to vexing 8.23 times - 4073 mana
Over 20 minutes an iksar will have to vexing 6 times - 2970 mana

That's 1103 mana over 20 minutes - 2.12 minutes (10% more of your time) dedicated solely to healing yourself.

This doesn't seem like a lot, but this is also best case scenario. Your taps do damage - yes - but it is not uncommon that much of that damage (and the resultant healing) does not get utilized. Hunting in dangerous places it is not advisable to let yourself end up 1k health in the hole (unless you have raid gear). That potential damage can also frequently get lost with the mob dying before the damage has had a chance to be fully applied. In a realistic scenario you are getting far less than a 1:2 ratio (for both healing and damage output) from the highest level and most efficient spells in the lifetap line.

It adds up monumentally.

Sitting at 56 in Lich a non-iksar loses 16 hp a tick. Iksar loses 6. Non iksar will lose health and need to bond of death in 4.5 minutes. Iksar in 12 mins.

Over 20 minutes a non-iksar will have to bond of death 4.44 times - 1600 mana
Over 20 minutes an iksar will have to bond of death 1.66 times - 600 mana

At 56 that is 1000 mana difference over 20 minutes - 2.5 extra minutes of meditating in lich form just to make up the difference (12.5% of your time).

[loramin]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Non-iksars get 7 ... so iksars are only net 11 better.

Was going by the table here:

http://wiki.project1999.com/Shaman


It may well be incorrect (it's a wiki ..)

[GinnasP99]

Iksars can't equip http://wiki.project1999.com/Hate_Crystal , something to consider. If you are enjoying necro as a non iksar race thats completely fine. Regen is good but vexing mordinia heals you a lot, and it's not as if iksars cast more powerful spells.

[Baler]

Pre-Kunark, Dark Elf or Erudite or Gnome
Kunark+, Iksar

The Iksar 20% exp penalty is not as bad as one would think.
The Iksar Racial Regen is invaluable when combined with lich spells.
Level 50+ You'll wish you went iksar if you don't.

If you plan to Raid,.. loot items won't really matter all that much because your job will be to twitch clerics and that's generally about it. So chances are you don't need to have BIS every slot. That's a fools errand on a necro or mage imho.

[Vicatin]

I had a 54 DE necro as my first toon on server. Now i have a 53 ikky Necro as well. Dont make the mistake i did

[Lhancelot]

Play what is most fun for you personally. Obviously non-iksar necros are enjoyable considering how many there are.

[Jmcwrestling]

Don't be Iksar_necro_42398
You'll be perfectly fine as a non lizard [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Tenlaar]

Originally Posted by Jmcwrestling [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Don't be Iksar_necro_42398
You'll be perfectly fine as a non lizard [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yes, you'll be perfectly fine, as long as you can accept that you will always be worse in a very real and quantifiable way.