Something Detrimental For PvP Deaths

[nilbog]

There's a lot of options.

I didn't say just food. It's possible to make it consumables (including food and drink), potions, gems, items with a vendor price < X, on and on.

The only argument I ever see is.. . "People won't play because of this or that". Like for me personally, I would want more incentive for pvping. RZ on live, and the original vztz emu were my item loot experiences. Had a lot of fun on both. Gives people a reason to do quests for no-drop gear.

While developing p99, people told me to do the exact opposite of most everything I did so I have a hard time believing them considering the server is successful in terms of population.

As I said, there were more servers than the coin-only ones. Consider that a lot of players came from an FFA environment and are making concessions for teams; try to be more open minded to their original server rulesets as well.

[Elderan]

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

There's a lot of options.

I didn't say just food. It's possible to make it consumables (including food and drink), potions, gems, items with a vendor price < X, on and on.

The only argument I ever see is.. . "People won't play because of this or that". Like for me personally, I would want more incentive for pvping. RZ on live, and the original vztz emu were my item loot experiences. Had a lot of fun on both. Gives people a reason to do quests for no-drop gear.

While developing p99, people told me to do the exact opposite of most everything I did so I have a hard time believing them considering the server is successful in terms of population.

As I said, there were more servers than the coin-only ones. Consider that a lot of players came from an FFA environment and are making concessions for teams; try to be more open minded to their original server rulesets as well.

Item loot is way too hardcore for the crowd you want to attract.

As said in the streams you want to bring people back but you also want to get blue people as well. Item loot will chase off blue players faster then R99 did.

No to item loot.

[Thrilla]

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I didn't like exp loss and championed the cause of removing it. If this is something players want back, you'll have to convince me of why and I'll re-evaluate it.

Having played on Rallos, I'm on the pro-item loot team.

People that claim to see the future say no one will play with item loot. Despite me not believing them, there are a variety of ways to implement it that we discussed on the stream. People played on other servers than coin-only teams and if possible, we should take the best parts of all of the servers.

Choice of 1 item, droppable. Not primary/secondary/ranged.
In bags? Not in bags? Could also make bagged loot droppable and the primary 8 inventory slots safe areas. Meaning if you sacrificed a bag slot to place an item there, it would be safe from looting. Alternately, you could make the items you're actually wearing safe from looting and inventoried droppables lootable.



Could make it non-armor, non-weapon pieces in general. Could make it earrings, rings, necklaces only.. on and on. We are not limited to the classic implementations of the original servers.



Casters do not respawn with mana.

If you do item loot I would hope that resists are tweaked BEFORE any item loot is implemented. May I suggest RZ type only non NO-DROP and not primary/secondary/offhand. Also nothing from bags. Even then I still think it is too hardcore for this population and will make PvP even duller, back in the day people generally didn't care about dying as much as they do in such a small community.

On RZ I'd wager 75-80% of the population ran around in NODROP only gear, the top tier PvPers went full gear because the resist system rewarded the risk vs reward to partial a spell vs possibly losing an item but could tip the scale of a fight. Resists have to be like Live PvP if you want item-loot to succeed otherwise just expect a bunch of naked ass people never wearing the gear and engaging only in zerg-like PvP where they feel they absolutely will win and won't take risks at all becuz of the thought of losing an item.

If you can replicate Live resists and pull it off it definitely adds another fun layer to the game, loved watching people run away as they bagged every single item starting with their robe if they were a caster lol. On Live it also rewarded risk takers, was like playing the lottery if you can pull off a quick gank in a raid force and loot a Trak BP/Legs cause they thought they were safe and didn't have the time to bag it. The idea has a lot of upside, but I feel the smallish population will make it harder to succeed as it did on Live. It also promotes more fatalities in the sense that if 2 people are going toe to toe and both are at risk of dying, they both may stick around becuz of the gamble of the item loot where as now people just b-line for the zone. Again I feel all the upside w/ item loot is completely dependant on the PvP resist system being reliable.

[Billbike]

Coin loot.

Anything farther than that is a deterant.

[Tradesonred]

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I didn't like exp loss and championed the cause of removing it. If this is something players want back, you'll have to convince me of why and I'll re-evaluate it.

Having played on Rallos, I'm on the pro-item loot team.

People that claim to see the future say no one will play with item loot. Despite me not believing them, there are a variety of ways to implement it that we discussed on the stream. People played on other servers than coin-only teams and if possible, we should take the best parts of all of the servers.

Choice of 1 item, droppable. Not primary/secondary/ranged.
In bags? Not in bags? Could also make bagged loot droppable and the primary 8 inventory slots safe areas. Meaning if you sacrificed a bag slot to place an item there, it would be safe from looting. Alternately, you could make the items you're actually wearing safe from looting and inventoried droppables lootable.



Could make it non-armor, non-weapon pieces in general. Could make it earrings, rings, necklaces only.. on and on. We are not limited to the classic implementations of the original servers.



Casters do not respawn with mana.

I would patch in a set of low, mid and high level no drop gear. That way we would establish a threshold which you cant go below. Something like the halloween 2001 set

[runlvlzero]

Faction loss from DIEING to pvp would be a terrible idea IMO. Otherwise I'm ok with coin and or item loot.

XP death sucks because it discourages people to "level up and fight" on a box with a level range +4/-4

On sullon xp death was ok because the box was more a:
RP server less of a PvP server
And because anyone could attack anyone, there was no good reason to stay below level 6. So you didn't have low levels griefing low levels.

It seems like the community wants a more deathmatch style box where PvP Happens a lot more often. If you want that you need to:
Allow melee binding in a few more select zones (not all as bind rushing is an issue on melee)
Make a zone like shadowrest on live and implement rez effects with a translocator NPC for bind. So on death people can med, and wait 20 mins before re-engaging.

This will encourage more random world pvp and penalize people who engage in mass pvp a little less.

Also corpse summoners are a must if you want mass pvp in zones like sky/hate,seb/fear/solb on a regular basis.

Ya'll may call this candyland shit. But it was all a factor in live pvp becoming more common they were all considered posative changes by the zek community.

TLDR ++++ 20-30 min rez effect in PVP and a safe one way out from death zone (i.e. u cant zone in alive) that is a safe zone with global ooc disabled in that zone, and allows people to rest up druing/after rez timer. I can deal with just rez timer, but would like to see a shadowrest implemented.

[filthyphil]

There certainly should be a penalty for PvP death on the new server. Here on red99 a common tactic to gain a foothold in zones is to simply bind in the zone. What this means for the player defending his camp within the zone is, he will have no choice but to continuously kill the attacking player until they log, leave the zone, or risk PvE while someone that you know is going to attack you again meditates at his bind 30 seconds away from your camp.

For instance my SK is in Guk at AC camp, a mage appears in the zone and I kill him about 3 times heads up. After the 3rd time he binds directly outside of the AC camp, just out of the water. I kill him at least another 5 times hoping to break his spirit. All the while he just respawns & meditates in a group of mobs that are KoS to me & attack me everytime I attack him. Now I have to leave the zone because if I let him sit there at his bind, he will just meditate and attack me again while I PvE.

So in short, the mage wins the zone because he risks losing nothing, but stands to gain the camp. While I risk losing the camp, exp death to PvE, & all the potential item/exp gain I lost while dealing with the situation.

No risk rewards this kind of behavior.

[Rec]

I don't need to see the future to know that new players(non hardcore), that the server needs to survive, that you're going to such great lengths to attract with a teams ruleset, won't tolerate losing their gear. They don't have the talent they're going to be losing lots of gear. They're struggling just to get their leather/banded and maybe an item from a dungeon that they're happy they got. Maybe if you let people loot food and water

[AffEcT]

Originally Posted by Rec [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't need to see the future to know that new players(non hardcore), that the server needs to survive, that you're going to such great lengths to attract with a teams ruleset, won't tolerate losing their gear. They don't have the talent they're going to be losing lots of gear. They're struggling just to get their leather/banded and maybe an item from a dungeon that they're happy they got. Maybe if you let people loot food and water

I started on RZ so i know that item loot is a lot of fun.
But that being said, i agree with you that new players and well, players who are not
used to the brutal nature of item loot will probably not stick around after a griefing session or two.

[mtb tripper]

did they say they were going to make another server?