Two-Boxing

[Hollywood]

Originally Posted by Vladesch [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I've been playing on and off for several years now on this server, and the drop off in numbers recently is quite apparent.
I've got 3 character, 2 of which can solo fine and they are the ones I end up playing.

Last few times I've been on the population was under 200 most of the time. I was just on recently... Saturday night latish and there were about 250. (Memory tells me there were regularly over 2000 back in 2001 on live)

The zones which I levelled up in classic has about 3 people each. Perhaps 1-2 of a suitable level, and mostly druids and necros.

So my non-solo character is an enchanter. I honestly think I'd have a better chance of getting a group if there were some people boxing. Cos right now I don't get groups. Period.

I had LFG on today (most busy time I've seen in the last week) for at least 4 hours and didn't get any tells. Zero. I am rather skeptical of these people who say they get groups very fast and don't even need to put LFG on. It certainly is the opposite of my experience.

Perhaps instead of saying we need boxing now, I might pose a question...
"How low does the peak server population have to go before people will consider a change".
What if we got 100 on a Saturday night? 50? 25? Or do we just let the server die rather than "cave in".

I don't want that because I have 3 characters I've spent a lot of time on, but I'm scared that is where things are heading.

Originally Posted by hdawg06 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The two boxing rule needs to be reevaluated. So few people play anymore that if you are not in a big/good guild that often times has groups going at all levels you really cannot do hardly anything. I feel like starting a melee character that isn't an uber twink is completely worthless because I don't know enough people that can help him get past 20 very easily. Yes, I could go and sit in a zone for 3-4 hours, but most of the time those zones barely have enough to make even 1 group, let alone many. Plus, Kunark is mainly dead in the low end. Nobody is ever in LOIO or FM, so until you get to about 30 and can go to OT you are screwed.

There are a lot of things that would actually make this server better that weren't "classic." Last time I checked, we have been off the classic patch rotation for nearly a year.

Not everybody has 60 days play time to devote to a character...

Originally Posted by Wildir [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I am in a fairly active guild and recently decided to come back and try to play, and at 54 it is hard to find a group. I have found one group and it was because someone in a guild group was leaving about the time I got on.

Boxing was part of the classic experience, I boxed a friends character after he quit through kunark and beyond.

I would 2 box so I could log on and be productive, and I usually added other players if I was going to be on for a while. This needs to be looked into, maybe only allow 2 logins per IP?

Thanks,
Wildcat

Several more good and honest examples of why two boxing would be more of a boon than a hinderance.

I didn't mention last time when I gave some reasons..I missed out on corpse run.
You grinded through the pain and suffering of making a high 50s or 60 cleric and you can't even jump on real quick to go ressurect yourself.

And also consider the communial potential of it. If I die, I'll log in and res myself and while I'm on I'll get some tells from others needing help. I have two options, I can kindly say 'no I'm busy' or I can take some additional time out after done with my corpse run/revive to help these people if albeit only for a short while. This not only benefits others but it's no real big hassle to me because thanks to being able to manage my own corpse situation, I can spare the time to support others in the game. Some of them will remember that and pay it forward.

So many people afk and idle anyways, what would be the harm in letting us idle secondary characters so people know we're around and can aid them if possible? It's not like there's a running tally of whom has what character/class and what times we play.

This server is becoming more like a few large guilds rather than one decent sized community and it's precisely because those who can get things done go off and do it, and those who can't end up leaving...and rightfully so.


The majority of people whom want to engage in dual boxing are not interested with the mindset to exploit or gain unfair advantage, they just simply want to be able to enjoy the game a bit without all the frustration.

Face it, the majority of us played EverQuest when we were teenagers. We're adults now with full time jobs, families, neighbors, community and endless responsibilities.
The joy in EverQuest is that it was fresh, exciting, different and difficult. Playing again on the emulator let's us reexperience a lot of that, but it also let's us suffer the pains of EverQuest that weren't clever design mechanics but rather over sights and faults of the developers.

We don't have the the time to deal with a lot of the nonsense that happens in the game..there needs to be some counter acting force to balance the needs of the community..some way to adapt the game. And the User Interface, modified code, scripts etc. to me are examples of where the Project 1999 team were trying to make it better.

If 'better but still classic' is the motto, then dual boxing does not hinder that mission.

[maahes]

Yeah if they never allow dual boxing at least, they eventually will lose their population completely.

[SamwiseBanned]

why is op banned lol

[Wildir]

The problem is lack of pick up groups, if the groups were available then I can see no boxing. I can go to Sebelis and sit there for over an hour without ever getting a group. On live, there were 5 to 7 groups in there normally all night long. Same can be said for any of the classic exp zones, there just is not open groups to join up with. They normally save openings for guild members or friends only. Wait till Velious comes out and everyone is spread out even further.

It would be interesting to see how the server would vote on it at this point in time.

[Liukang]

sounds like EQ classic to me

[pharmakos]

boxing ruined the Progression servers on EQLive imo

on a good night on Vulak there'd be less than 200 accounts in general chat. i personally knew several six-boxers.

early in the morning on a bad day there would less than 100 accounts in general chat.

i for one get really frustrated when i can't form a group with my warrior, but in the long run i am glad that this server only allows single boxing.

430 individuals playing on p99 blue right now btw.

[Danyelle]

I never said that I was for or against i, though. I simply was stating that using the "ban boxing because boxing being banned is Classic" argument is stupid because it is, in fact, not Classic. I never stated I was pro or anti-boxing though.

In fact I'm in the middle ground. Letting free boxing is indeed bad, but cutting it out completely can be just as harmful. Especially in this situation.

Let's put it this way. On one hand, if you permit free boxing, you have people rolling up however many toons their computers can handle. For some they may barely be able to handle one account as it is, others may be able to load up around 30 at once. I personally can load 12 if I manage it right. There would be some differences. For example, without MQ2 availability, boxing all those toons would be hard as hell if not impossible. Although, arguably, by being able to load them all in it may encourage them to try to use MQ2 regardless of rules being set against it or not. Also Titanium handles like shit with modern PCs. While Underfoot or Live clients etc can load up that many, Titanium may cause issues with it. Cutting that number in half. Either way you look at it, once someone gets 6 toons in he/she never groups again. This breaks the "multiplayer" aspect of Everquest and destroys the game's foundation.

On the other hand. We have people backed up for like 4 freaking months waiting on IP exemptions just so they can play with their children, spouses, or friends/room mates. I don't care if it's a free server or not, that's unacceptable. Especially considering many people have donated, in many instances, several times. At that point, for them, it's no longer a "free server". Whether it was by their own will or not, you owe those people good service. 4 or so month backups on IP exemptions is not good service. No corporation would be able to get away with something like that, why should this be any different? I obviously realize that you have a lot of other things on hand to deal with. But if you can't keep up with that kind of thing you have 3 options. "Hire" more staff, enable limited boxing, or remove IP exemptions altogether. It doesn't seem the devs wanna go with option 1, and option 3 would piss people off lowering the pop even more than it already is. That leaves you with option 2. I can promise you this delay in response time is a large contributing factor to low and declining server pop (in addition to things like response time to petitions, time between content release, and massive petty trolling feuds between top end guilds and players that never get resolved).

The best course of action, in my opinion, is to enable 2-3 toon maximum accounts up at any given time per IP, and then do away with IP exemptions entirely (and revoke IP exemptions already handed out). This will permit people to come in with family and friends under the same roof and get right to playing, as opposed to waiting an eternity. It will still leave room for grouping. It also covers things like "I don't ever have enough time to sell in EC because when I'm not doing real life things, I'm out xp grinding or raiding" or "I play at night/am in a different time zone when few people are on and can rarely find a group" or "I just had some asshole steal my stuff while trying to do an item transfer..." either because "....he was a thief and /ex'd" or "...because he found the stuff I dropped and picked it up" etc etc.

Besides, if there are indeed that many people strongly against it, I doubt those people would box even if it was permitted (if you do, that's kinda hypocritical don't you think), which means that the only people boxing would be those few NOT against it. People using the raised IP limit to play with family or friends under the same roof aren't really boxing and don't count. So I fail to see how that small number would cause any harm, unless you all would give in to the tempting evil vice that is "boxing" the minute the IP limit got raised, despite your firm stance against it.

[pharmakos]

if boxing was permitted i would start to box

i prefer it not be permitted though

[maahes]

It is an argument that has its pros and cons. I personally know a dozen people that would still be here if they allowed boxing. Basically a server is going to come along that allows boxing but also claims to respect the "classic" feel everyone wants and will slowly claim population. In the mean time more people who nerd rage over boxers will join this server. Only time will tell.

[pharmakos]

what if they allowed boxing but only on red =p

i of course understand why red players might not want this. it would do a lot to bring up red's population tho =p