My America

[Alawen Everywhere]

Why are people standing around watching willful destruction of private property? I would have felt obligated as a concerned citizen to stop that senseless violence.

[Toony]

Originally Posted by Alawen Everywhere [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Why are people standing around watching willful destruction of private property? I would have felt obligated as a concerned citizen to stop that senseless violence.

Cowards watching bigger (masked) cowards.

[Extunarian]

I do have trouble believing that those people dressed in all black and covering their faces were really there to protest peacefully. Perhaps if these people didn't need to break windows to get their rocks off than the temporary laws that Taxi speaks of wouldn't have been necessary.

[astarothel]

Originally Posted by Alawen Everywhere [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Perhaps it was lost that I am not the one blaming America for Canada's troubles. I think Canada is a big boy and responsible for its own problems. I think it has been pointed out several times that America has plenty of troubles of our own.

Not on me, however the need to belittle Canada by referring to it as a dim-witted little brother to America when the entire international family tree has the collective intelligence of a plethora of monkeys armed with machetes came off hypocritical to me, hence my response.

[astarothel]

Originally Posted by Alawen Everywhere [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Why are people standing around watching willful destruction of private property? I would have felt obligated as a concerned citizen to stop that senseless violence.

Many did try and stop it. A number of concerned citizens were injured attempting to stop those that stepped out of the black bloc formation to permit acts of vandalism.

From an enforcement perspective it is easier to control the damages than it is to police potentially violent opposing factions. You have to limit your variables.

The other issue with citizens stopping it is the technique of black bloc itself. In black bloc you get out of the black and back into your streetclothes in the mob so it is impossible to distinguish individuals. This makes it almost impossible for law officials to distinguish concerned citizens from plainclothes black bloc members. Black bloc uses this technique to protect their own members, while endangering every day civilians that attempt to stop them.

As soon as a civilian is injured for being anywhere near the black bloc, private presses roar over police brutality. I'm sorry, involvement in a mob situation, either to attempt to stop it or abet it, carries risks. The police can't tell the difference between someone that tries to stop black bloc, or assist it.

What I can tell you is that law enforcement officials didn't look at how to break black bloc up ahead of time. If they had their response could have been much more effective.

[Taxi]

Originally Posted by astarothel [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What I can tell you is that law enforcement officials didn't look at how to break black bloc up ahead of time. If they had their response could have been much more effective.

Its not like they need a manual for it. There was so much manpower and brutality available that a few hundreds people dressed in black is nowhere near a threat. Why did the police let them trash up the place? Like i said before, its the same pattern every time. They let people smash stuff up (wether they are protesters or police undercovers) and then they move in and arrest, beat up, disperse everyone else.

I dont subscribe to that view that police were incompetent. They were competent, they did what they were there for. Justify their 1 billion dollar tag price and intimidate, beat up, harass, arrest legitimate protesters and journalists.

People often think this is just radical protester bullshit. I did too until i saw cops intentionally hurt people with crazed smile on their faces, run after random pedestrian on horses and attempting to baton them on the head, people sitting down getting their glasses crushed on their faces. In Quebec city in 2001 at the summit of the americas, the neighboorhood was so drenched in CS gas that an old lady died in her appartement suffocating.

We are losing our democratic rights in general in the western world. The politicians are pushing in more and more anti-democratic laws in the name of combating "terrorism". If that doesnt sound familiar, it should because its how the nazis came to power. Again it sounds funny, look at that crazy person, talking about nazis. But the things ive witnessed personally in the last 10 years makes me very afraid that if we dont fight for our democratic rights very soon, we will enter a dark age of police states in the western world that will end who knows when. The elites have been doing it to natives, to the rest of the world for centuries, now its us, their own population. We are the enemy.

[Alawen Everywhere]

Originally Posted by astarothel [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Not on me, however the need to belittle Canada by referring to it as a dim-witted little brother to America when the entire international family tree has the collective intelligence of a plethora of monkeys armed with machetes came off hypocritical to me, hence my response.

My comment was completely sarcastic. I've already mentioned in this thread several Canadian policies and practices that I admire and that America could do well by incorporating into our own society. In no way were any of my comments meant to disparage any other nation.

I initiated this thread to address America's problems and challenges as well as our strengths and hopes.

[Extunarian]

So it's okay to vandalize property, start things on fire, and put the safety of peaceful protesters at risk because there were only a few hundred of them and they were outnumbered by police?

I'm not as worried about your vast one-world-totalitarian-nazi-government conspiracy as I am about this type of thinking:

"A group of anarchists broke away from the main, non-violent protest by trade unions and other groups around the summit conference centre and began smashing the windows of banks and chain stores and torching police patrol cars in the shopping and financial districts...Footage from the Canadian broadcaster CTV also showed them looting, and threatening photographers."

"This isn't violence," one masked protester told the Toronto Star newspaper. "This is vandalism against violent corporations. We did not hurt anybody. The corporations are the ones hurting people."

Now that is some rationalization right there.

[Taxi]

Originally Posted by Extunarian [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

So it's okay to vandalize property, start things on fire, and put the safety of peaceful protesters at risk because there were only a few hundred of them and they were outnumbered by police?

I'm not as worried about your vast one-world-totalitarian-nazi-government conspiracy as I am about this type of thinking:

"A group of anarchists broke away from the main, non-violent protest by trade unions and other groups around the summit conference centre and began smashing the windows of banks and chain stores and torching police patrol cars in the shopping and financial districts...Footage from the Canadian broadcaster CTV also showed them looting, and threatening photographers."

"This isn't violence," one masked protester told the Toronto Star newspaper. "This is vandalism against violent corporations. We did not hurt anybody. The corporations are the ones hurting people."

Now that is some rationalization right there.

Its not a conspiracy, its what you can deduct from attending just one of those world-class protests. If youre not just trying to "win" here, and youre truly interested in finding out what goes on, just go to one. All it takes is one direct observation on how cops behave during these protests.

Heres one quote i found about how police are justifying all this repression:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/...rticle1621198/

“Unfortunately, their criminal activity was made a lot easier by the complicity of the crowd,” he told CP24. “And so we had to contain and control the crowd in an effort to control those criminals.”

This is the exact same logic that US soldiers have been fed in Iraq, that anyone around someone firing on US troops is a fair target because they are "letting" them shoot on US soldiers.

So now every protester needs to be "controlled" (beaten up, penned, arrested and released without charges, intimidated) because they are "complicit" in the criminal activity.

Im not going to cry over a starbucks windows getting smashed, but i think its counter-productive to what these protesters who are using black block tactic are probably trying to accomplish. When they arent undercover cops accomplishing just what they set out for.

That being said, using this as an excuse for all the fascistic behavior you can be witness to if you go to one of these protests, is whats really criminal.

[Hasbinbad]

..boy you guys are gonna shit bricks when you find out the CIA is behind black bloc..