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[heartbrand]

What is grief to one person is not grief to another, it's something that's called:

sub·jec·tive   [suhb-jek-tiv] Show IPA
adjective
1.
existing in the mind; belonging to the thinking subject rather than to the object of thought ( opposed to objective).

[Nirgon]

Originally Posted by Dullah [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

A huge portion of the server rolling around for the sole purpose of putthing their name higher on a leaderboard = grief, and its not classic.

I have so many mean things to say, but I'll just structure an argument rather than carry one out.

Non classic = scaling pvp range with ffa
Red = 4 lvls, item loot

This isn't a classic implementation of any of the live servers right now.

Leader board = classic element to a team based PvP server

I know anything like item loot or a pvp leader board kills the server in the eyes of many. But it didn't on live.

Griefing is xp loss on death and bind camping someone. That exists here. Let's remove that first. At least with no item loot you can bag all your shit before you die or xp in planar and no real loss on death.

[Rogean]

Originally Posted by Nirgon [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You feel like doing something crazy? How about something that tries to automatically create a screen shot from a hovering camera on the kill?

The server has no texture rendering or any sort of graphics system the client uses. It would essentially have to record all coordinates, movement, animations, etc, then create some way to replay a rendering in a client. ie... too much work for the gain and not even sure if possible.

[heartbrand]

Griefing to me is repeatedly killing someone over and over who is afk, giving someone pve deaths intentionally (though case dependent), or repeatedly killing someone who is trying to loot and scoot. Most of that can be solved by enforcing LnS and bind-camping, or simply removing exp loss on pvp deaths and not giving credit on leaderboard for repeat kills within x minutes or what not.

[Dullah]

I agree, removing exp loss would be a step in the right direction.

When you change the game from being about progression in the content itself, to being about progression on a leaderboard, it will remove many of the elements that make Everquest what it is. The sense of community is severely lacking here, as can be seen by reading these forums for 5 minutes. A large portion of the population started here with the stated goals of griefing as many people off the server as possible. They were successful. Offering built in mechanics to encourage this sort of play style is a bad idea, imo.

You can see that this opinion is shared with a large portion of the population, because its more or less the reason people continually join Nihilum. They want to play EQ, and PVP, not just pvp.

[Nirgon]

Item loot isn't grief only.

There xp loss is a set back to discourage bind rushing..

Death is painful with or without xp loss, people can still chain kill aka "grief" (if that's what you want to kill it) others.

Item loot provided an incentive to log in for the unguilded. It also remedies twinks griefing (like in field of bone coming up).

[Dullah]

When I say grief, I don't mean generic pvp, or killing a player.

Grief is when theres so much pvp and ganking going on, you can't accomplish anything else or experience the game. I realize a lot of people look at red like its the anti-blue, but thats not what I came here for. I didn't play blue because it didn't have pvp. That doesn't mean when I come to a pvp server, I don't want to enjoy pve.

PvP makes PvE fun. PvP is not the end all. Catering heavily to those who just want to PvP will only serve to take away from the classic EQ experience.

[Tradesonred]

Originally Posted by Dullah [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

When I say grief, I don't mean generic pvp, or killing a player.

Grief is when theres so much pvp and ganking going on, you can't accomplish anything else or experience the game. I realize a lot of people look at red like its the anti-blue, but thats not what I came here for. I didn't play blue because it didn't have pvp. That doesn't mean when I come to a pvp server, I don't want to enjoy pve.

PvP makes PvE fun. PvP is not the end all. Catering heavily to those who just want to PvP will only serve to take away from the classic EQ experience.

Problem here is I rolled to experience something like a classic EQ PVP experience, not a purple99 experience.

Grief is when theres so much pvp going on? lol @ pvp player

The best times on Rallos for me was Halloween 2001, 200 people in zones ganking the fuck out of each other for 72 hours straight fighting over event mobs.

[Nirgon]

I'll just wait for the official Rogean or Nilbog response on the issue. Whether it is still debatable, or a "no not ever".

That said, I know Nilbog's stance on the issue. He's a pretty smart fella, especially compared to every one else here on a regular basis.

[notCwall]

item loot discourages pvp, creates an even larger gap between melee viability and caster viability

yellow text encourages pvp

leaderboard encourages pvp